Looking for John P. Salamone

The notion of 'thousands of victims' was crucial to generate universal public outrage. However, having 3000 angry families breathing down their necks was never part of the perps' demented plan. Our ongoing analyses and investigations suggest that NO one died on 9/11.

Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 7th, 2013, 11:36 pm

omaxsteve wrote:
The only thing that I now for sure is that if,my brother or sister, or parent or child, or someone I loved was said to have died on one the planes that didn't crash, or to have died in a tower that was said to have collapsed because of a fake plane crash, I would not sleep until I exposed the perpetrators of this hoax. We need to get a brother or sister, if one exists, to come here and explain why they are not seeking answers and explanations for the deaths of their loved ones.
(...)
How did the next of kin prove their relationship to the vicsims?


Dear omaxsteve,

Here's a classic example of the sort of stuff you'll find on the internets : here we have three purported "next-of-kin who lost loved ones on 9/11" , all of them 'coincidentally' commenting under a brief, 33-second-long "Camera Planet" clip:

SOURCE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2WC0B-XQic

Image

I don't suppose you would encourage us to contact the above three Youtube users and ask them to prove their claims?

My point being: the internet is clearly infested by a gigantic swarm of such obvious trolls - typing away all day long in their sorry cubicles. In fact, we should consider ourselves fortunate not to have zillions of such trolls invading this forum - and I believe this is partly thanks to our strict admission rules - and partly thanks to our no-nonsense treatment of entities who manage to register here, only to produce scarce and flimsy evidence of the former existence of a "9/11 victim".

Honestly now, omaxsteve: how do you propose that we could improve our 'manners' and 'tolerance levels' - when confronted with entities such as BBS who based her claims on three old Kodak photos of a guy she states was her former college mate John Salamone - and that this guy was a good kisser? BBS even tried to push the notion that this John P. Salamone was actually listed in the SSDI - and I had to spend time and effort to demonstrate that this was not the case. As far as I'm concerned, this BBS was just some time-wasting BS. And the very last thing we need here are BS time-wasters.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby omaxsteve on February 7th, 2013, 11:50 pm

Hoi and Simon:

The treatment of new members is not really any of my business, I also do not want to appear to be questioning your judgement as again, that is not my place.

I do not mean to be critical of your work as a moderators,or as a researchers. I think (both of) you are terrific at both. I only wish that everyone here used the same level of civility that they would expect from others. I am not sure that outsiders will always distinguish between hostility towards potential shills versus just plain hostility as a means to keep others from questioning your theories. (as in the sites that refuse to entertain or even allow discussion of the "no plane" theory).

All your points, and Hoi's,rebutting my defense of BlindedbyScience, are well taken and I appreciate the fact that you responded with your usual candor and thoughtfulness.

There are some of your points that I disagree with but there is nothing wrong with that.

The purpose of my writing in "defense" of the poster is only to point out that there may be some negative consequences to the level of hostility an disrespect shown to new members.

I may have been incorrect in my assumption, but I believe that one of the primary purposes of the forum is to disseminate information and expose the MSM for the hoaxsters that they are. In my opinion the best way to do that is to have as many new members join as possible. Each new fake event , like the Sandy Hook affair brings more visitors and exposes more people to the media fakery. By posting and contributing the new members become more more involved and start digging deeper into the research here and the deeper they dig the more aware they become that the media is nothing more than a propaganda machine. As they get more convinced they will spread their opinion to others.

Treating members with disrespect and `chasing" members away with rudeness, when the exact same point same can be made in a diplomatic fashion does not serve any useful purpose.

This little anecdote may better illustrate my point. When my brother and I argue, I can always tell when I am "winning " the argument by his demeanor, The angrier he gets, the louder he shouts, the more he loses his temper and becomes hostile , the better I am doing. When an impartial outsiders watches a debate the debater who "keeps his cool" always seems more credible than the one who acts "hostile".

A good theory , especially one that is so shocking and incredible when first heard like the vicsim theory, gains strength by welcoming, and standing up to, and refuting, challenges to its validity through sound arguments and evidence NOT by bullying and dismissing "out of hand" any and all who dare to challenge it.

Challenging one`s assertions is far more appealing than challenging the person who makes them. The fact that someone was a classmate of a vicsim a dozen or so years prior to 911 does nothing to invalidate the whole VicSim theory. The fact that someone believes that "some" victims were real people and others were fictitional, should not in itself be reason to call them names and be abused. At worse, it may mean that some of the identities were taken from, or based on, actual living people.

And yes, while on this forum we are just screen names and anonymous entities, for the most part there are real people behind those entities.

Best regards,

Steve O.


P.S. the decrease in the quality of my writing is probably due to a combination of old age , and the fact that my old trusty large screen desktop with the nice big keyboard is no longer functional and now I am trying to get used to a tiny laptop with very small keys and a 14 inch screen. I will try to make a better effort with my spelling and punctuation in the future.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 8th, 2013, 12:14 am

Dear omaxsteve,

Your points are well taken and appreciated - and I fully share your views as to the importance of maintaining style, class and composure when faced with opposition. Perhaps these skills only come with old age, as hinted in your above post. I have the utmost respect for wiser, older people - and I'm certainly not getting younger myself, hehe!
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby fbenario on February 8th, 2013, 2:39 am

And now, with the BBS chapter apparently closed for good, it seems a good time to remind less-experienced members to take care not to answer critiques with defensive, emotional, hurt, repetitious, or unhappy responses. You will immediately and automatically make suspect your credibility and good faith.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby hoi.polloi on February 8th, 2013, 3:54 am

The purpose of my writing in "defense" of the poster is only to point out that there may be some negative consequences to the level of hostility an disrespect shown to new members.


Yes, there is an air of hostility to this 'place' and I am responsible for much of it. The negative consequence is that we scare off a certain brand of good-natured people. These good-natured people may never be convinced someone is lying if that someone is talking to them like a baby. "Oh wuvy dubby - I lost my hubby - boohoo"

They may always be convinced I am in the wrong because I am acting like an asshole.

This is a logical fallacy. It is pure emotion.

I have often lamented that I feel the need to use despicable language on this site. I really do. I graciously eagerly look for opportunities to be kind, but the shills and trolls are just so spiteful and cold while pretending to be caring people. In person, I am not such an asshole. This darn Internet thing just doesn't breathe like the real world with all its subtleties and human mannerisms that requires in-the-flesh dialogue to be much more "normal" and "nice". You guys are upholding real-life standards for something that cannot ever compare or "live up to" (forgive a pun) real life.

As for politeness coming with "old age", Simon, I don't think so. I've met plenty of rude old farts that I actually respect pretty highly. And the obsequiousness of some others makes me cringe. Which isn't to say I prefer rudeness. On the contrary. I respect your cool head very highly. On the other hand, I have seen the flip side of your appearance of nonchalance. Your ability to be very cold. So you can tell me I act like an asshole and a jerk on this forum and I accept that. But you can't tell me it's because you are better. Sorry. That's just an arrogant and rude statement in and of itself. Please don't lose your cool manner and politeness. It's great. If you want, you can think positive and say someone has to be nasty around here or we look like a bunch of pansies (that we may, in fact, actually be.) but you don't have to. You can continue to assume the worst about my attitude.

I am not going to always pay courtesy to people who - to me, at least - clearly underhandedly slip in the occasional jab at the forum while acting polite in every other respect. Why do I have to apologize for being rude to people that I genuinely think are responsible for fabricating the worst wars of aggression in our generation? If they are so psycho, they don't even "feel" what you imagine they are feeling. It's their job to create the appearance of a sympathetic character that casts aspersions on our own.

Why should we pretend we're not a bunch of pompous jerks, when that's exactly what we act like 24/7 on this forum? I don't care for politeness on the Internet. It's outdated.

Having said that, from now on, I will look even closer at what I write to perps (than I already do). Perhaps it's not necessary to totally misrepresent our true feelings. I just have the hunch that this format requires that it is. You may have noticed I am not posting here regularly. I may just give up entirely if we're going to cave to an air of politeness so we can "entertain" the psycho mindgames of the sim operators.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 8th, 2013, 9:32 am

hoi.polloi wrote:
If you want, you can think positive and say someone has to be nasty around here or we look like a bunch of pansies (that we may, in fact, actually be.) but you don't have to.

Hoi,
Yes, I want to - and I'll say so. Always will. :)
hoi.polloi wrote:
You can continue to assume the worst about my attitude.

Never have! :mellow:
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby SmokingGunII on February 8th, 2013, 3:02 pm

It's a difficult balance between being courteous and weeding out trolls/shills/agent provocateurs, call them what you will and I sit somewhere between Steve O and Hoi!

Antipodean has echoed my first thoughts on this thread when I didn't see any correlation between the "college" pics and the "official" pic. BBS has since added other links and images which contradict previous images even further - for instance when did he lose his hair and why does he look like a man mountain in the "Legacy" photograph but not in the photo with the shildren in the garden?

So I'll reserve judgement for the moment as to whether this chap was real or not. However, I have suggested before that I think it is quite possible some "victims" were real people and my guess is that these particular type of vicsims would have been pulled from the intelligence and military community. It wouldn't take too much of a stretch to believe that Cantor Fitzgerald was a CIA front to achieve this very illusion? Certainly, I have found links with the military with a number of victims' families.

Following on from the Legacy post yesterday I did a brief search for the address on Google Streetview. The address (a curious estate of semi circular groups of properties from aerial view) and the street is not covered by the Google camera This is a problem I have encountered when I have tried to trace other properties that belong to vicsims spouses etc.

The other stuff I quickly discovered yesterday is that his alleged widow is a co-founder of the Families of September 11 group and has also been part of a group that now promotes the teaching of the official 9/11 fable in classrooms, with a little help from the Holocaust commision, of course.

http://www.njjewishnews.com/article/597 ... RUEhvLkLTM
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 8th, 2013, 6:13 pm

SmokingGunII wrote:The other stuff I quickly discovered yesterday is that his alleged widow is a co-founder of the Families of September 11 group and has also been part of a group that now promotes the teaching of the official 9/11 fable in classrooms, with a little help from the Holocaust commission, of course.

http://www.njjewishnews.com/article/597 ... RUEhvLkLTM



Crikey, you're right Smokey! I knew I'd heard that name before...

Image
Mary Ellen SALAMONE (alleged wife of purported 9/11 "victim" John P. Salamone)


John Salamone "was only 37; he missed his kids' whole childhood," said his wife, cofounder of Families of September 11, a nonprofit group advocating for those affected by the attack. "The story couldn't end there for me. "It couldn't be about hate," she said. "Out of his death, positive things had to grow. He didn't die for no reason."

Salamone said the loss of her husband "inspired me and I inspired the curriculum, and maybe the curriculum will inspire hundreds and thousands of kids. Then, one death will make a huge difference and I can sleep better at night."
http://articles.philly.com/2011-09-06/n ... ange-death


Here's the FAMILIES OF SEPTEMBER 11 website: http://www.familiesofseptember11.org/ne ... tem_id=118
(Note that our old 'friend' Carie Lemack is also on the board of directors of FOS11)

Image


In other words, Mary Ellen SALAMONE is not just 'your average' 9/11 family member - but more like a 'high-profile', Mary Fetchet' type of grieving relative... She's right up there with the Big Girls of the 9/11 hoax cointelpro team.

This recent BBS Cluesforum visit is making more and more sense.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby brianv on February 8th, 2013, 7:15 pm

Haha my thoughts exactly. Blinded by Bullshit indeed.

Image

Googling Images Mary Fetchet throws up an astounding array of faeces. Is Mary Ellen above one of them. She looks same-ish! Hmm.

Simon, I guess you've had no reply from the John P's Alimony Foundation.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 8th, 2013, 7:26 pm

brianv wrote:Simon, I guess you've had no reply from the John P's Alimony Foundation.

Nope - no reply yet. Still waiting. But we're not in a hurry, are we? <_<
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby omaxsteve on February 8th, 2013, 8:25 pm

It seems as if Mary Ellen Salamone was also a witness at the Moussaoui trial:

There was no laughter when Mary Ellen Salamone, crying as she entered the courtroom, took the stand. She painted a different marital portrait, saying she and her husband, John -- who worked for the Cantor Fitzgerald brokerage firm on the 104th floor of the World Trade Center -- did not represent the typical "9/11 story. Sobbing from the witness stand, Salamone said she and her husband went through many ups and downs, and "as fate would have it, he died in the middle of a not-so-good" phase. She said she called John "a million times" that morning but never got through. "I was so desperate to talk to him and tell him I loved him before he died," she said. "In death, I did not get John. I got a body bag seven months later that I had to say goodbye to in the basement of a refrigerated mortuary or morgue, and I had to try to find peace with that.""


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00554.html

The John Salomone entity and his "surviving" wife looks to be one of the media favorited and "featured" vicsims. This Mary Ellen sure made the rounds, she also spoke at the Seton Hall 9-11 remembrance ceremony .

In a poignant and personal reminder of the harsh realities of the attacks, Mrs. Mary Ellen Salamone, whose husband John, working for Cantor Fitzgerald, perished on 9-11, and who is the mother of two Seton Hall Prep students, freshman Aiden and junior Alexander, delivered a riveting keynote address.


Mrs. Salamone was a founding member of the assistance organization, Families of September 11, and serves on Board of the National School Center for Crisis and Bereavement. She was appointed by the White House to serve on the Education Committee of the National Commission of Children and Disasters.


Along with her personal recollections of the day, her address to Seton Hall’s students centered on the challenge of turning the remembrance of the horrors of September 11, 2001 into a pledge of service to our community, with a particular challenge to the students to pledge 10 hours of service during the first trimester. Her message was to turn the events born in hatred into a winning strategy built on service and commitment. She left the students with her closing statement: “That’s how we will win.”


http://www.shp.org/podium/default.aspx? ... 20336&rc=0


Seton Hall had no less than 14 of their Alumni killed off on 911.

John Bocchi '85
Dean Eberling, M.B.A. '85
Craig Lilore '95
William J. Martin, Jr. '93
Daniel McGinley '83
Angel Pena, J.D. '83
John Pocher '88
Kenneth Tarantino '83
Anthony Infante, Jr., M.A.E. '98
Fred V. Morrone
James Nelson
Alfonse Joseph Niedermeyer III, M.A.E. '00
James Romito, M.A.E. '98
Mark Whitford '93

Does that not seem like a disproportionately high number to have come from one school?

regards,

Steve O.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby lux on February 9th, 2013, 2:15 am

With the amount of evidence we've seen of the use of sims and actors, isn't it logical to assume that someone is most likely lying when they claim to have known a 9/11 victim? Isn't the onus on them to prove otherwise?
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby fbenario on February 9th, 2013, 2:58 am

SmokingGunII wrote:However, I have suggested before that I think it is quite possible some "victims" were real people and my guess is that these particular type of vicsims would have been pulled from the intelligence and military community.

Why in the world do you, and numerous others, continue to put forth this theory? So what if it is 'possible'? No one has presented any convincing evidence that 'terror' victims were real people. Instead of bringing up the possibility once again, how about posting credible evidence supporting your 'possible' theory.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby CTGal1011 on February 9th, 2013, 1:58 pm

lux wrote:With the amount of evidence we've seen of the use of sims and actors, isn't it logical to assume that someone is most likely lying when they claim to have known a 9/11 victim? Isn't the onus on them to prove otherwise?


FOR SURE. I don't understand how these vicsim searchers get so bent out of shape when they are questioned to the nth. I haven't been a member a long time, but my feeling is that you are coming to a forum that is all about debunking. So you better be ready to be debunked! I am sure many will attest to this, but I feel the mods and other well respected members are actually very open to alternative views. Just be able to back it up! Simple, no? I've participated in some discussions about some of the minor psyops in other threads, and all were more than gracious when there was evidence presented that something wasn't a psyop. That is the coolest thing about this forum. If you make your point, have more than enough evidence contrary to the original "idea" of what happened, and are willing to go the extra mile to prove it, then why on earth would you feel defensive about them questioning you? If you are right, and you know it, then you should be able to prove it. And then we move on to something else. I don't get what is so difficult about this concept. However, a tiny part of me wanted to see what BBS was going to "offer" on other subjects. I guess I am a rubbernecker after all.
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Re: Looking for John P. Salamone

Postby simonshack on February 9th, 2013, 3:19 pm

CTGal1011 wrote: However, a tiny part of me wanted to see what BBS was going to "offer" on other subjects. I guess I am a rubbernecker after all.

Dear CtGal, a tiny part of me is a bit like that as well ...

The thing is, when I've seen enough - that's enough. Let me just inform everyone that BBS contacted me on Facebook ten days ago or so (yeah, I'm on the horrid FB too now, reluctantly - just to show that I'm a 'normal' person - heh!...). BBS then proceeded to send me a string of messages (7 in total), most of which were lamenting about Hoi's "bad manners" and "verbal abuse". But get this: a few hours after 'she' was blocked from Cluesforum - 'her' FB page was simply deleted - point blank! In her last message she had called me "the worst kind of liar", so I replied: "A liar? What exactly have I been lying about?" But my reply never went through - as her FB account was already gone...

Now, what does that tell you?
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