"AIRPLANE CRASHES" - all over the world

Anything on the news and elsewhere in the media with evidence of digital manipulation, bogus story-lines and propaganda

"AIRPLANE CRASHES" - all over the world

Postby Seneca on May 7th, 2014, 10:05 pm

I am probably not the only one that has noticed that a lot of hoaxes and conspiracy theories (true or false) include planes. For example:

-atomic bombs
-pearl harbor
-UFO sightings
-9/11
-acid rain
-chemtrails
-global warming (lots of people do not want to fly because of the carbon
footprint)
-terrorist plots/TSA searches
-CIA abductions
-flu pandemics
-"no fly zones" for "peacekeeping"
-Syrian chemical weapon attacks
-Malaysian airplane
-Iceland volcano eruption
-famous people dying in sometimes suspicous plane crashes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fa ... _accidents
-Snowden living in Moscow airport

I do not think this is a coincidence, there must be a reason. A possible reason for the occurrence of airplanes is that they do not want people to travel to other countries. To keep us uninformed? But personally I do not see much difference between people who travel a lot and people who do not.
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby HonestlyNow on May 10th, 2014, 2:12 pm

*
Add:
-fliers, flyers (911 "Missing Person" Posters)
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby Seneca on May 11th, 2014, 3:01 pm

Yes! And I didn't even mention Avian flue; And I forgot drones
http://motherboard.vice.com/read/drone- ... arly-april

I think I had better posted this in "the living room."
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby hoi.polloi on May 12th, 2014, 5:26 pm

Well anything significantly advanced in giving the average person raw physical power must be contained by the powers that be. The reason we are meant to be scared off by the demonic nature of hijackers is so that we don't begin playing with the idea of hijacking aircraft to amass an army of airliners.

Guns are powerful and grenades are powerful. So they wish to control those. Planes and trucks and trains and boats have raw physical powerful so they wish to control those. One could argue the fakery spooking of the public is a consequence and externalization of the security world's anxiety and mistrust of people in control of industrial toys. The military's goal seems to be to identify and acquire power, in whatever form it exists in our world.

Couldn't we argue that the Great War was used to confiscate great public inventions such as these? Since then, the military has played an overly intimate role in managing the industry of all large/powerful machinery or even any technology with any sort of leverage: computers, software, mining and materials, F1 racers, and so on.

It can't be denied you have a point about the airplanes. I would suggest it's because airplanes are something the average citizen could in fact hijack and control given the ambition to do so. But I think they want us to ignore and forget that and keep it out of our minds using the fear triggers kept in public dialogue with the media's simulation devices.
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby lux on May 12th, 2014, 6:47 pm

Seneca wrote:I do not think this is a coincidence, there must be a reason. A possible reason for the occurrence of airplanes is that they do not want people to travel to other countries.


I would say this is the major reason. Not only news media psyops suggest this but Hollywood movies & TV as well. There have been a number of melodramas that depict the dangers of travel over the decades from Hitchcock's "The Man Who Knew Too Much" to TV's "Locked Up Abroad" and many others.

To keep us uninformed? But personally I do not see much difference between people who travel a lot and people who do not.


It appears to me that not only do they not want people to travel but they also want people to congregate in large metro area and stay away from "the boonies." Countless horror stories by both the news media and Hollywood involve all manner of dangers "in the wild" from being attacked by animals to being dragged off by mythical monsters or UFOs. If you watch USA TV these days, especially cable TV, there is a constant parade of new shows about "monsters" and other dangers lurking just beyond the city limits. It's really gotten ridiculous.

The overall message seems clear to me: It's much too dangerous to go anywhere so just stay home in a nice safe city where we can watch your every move.
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby Libero on May 12th, 2014, 7:43 pm

Law firms participating in airplane "accident" cases surely must be profiting handsomely from the events. Take this one for instance:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kreindler_%26_Kreindler

Notable litigation:

Pan Am Flight 103
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1345&p=2371299&hilit=Pan+Am+Flight+103#p2371299

TWA 800
viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1638&p=2385803&hilit=twa+800#p2385803

Swissair 111
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=246&p=2367058&hilit=Swissair+111#p2367058

9/11
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=467

Continental Connection Flight 3407
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FcmwtY4CQw

Asiana Flight 214
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=1644&hilit=asiana+214


And here's another:

A U.S.-based law firm said it expects to represent families of more than half of the passengers on board the missing Malaysian Airlines flight in a lawsuit against the carriers and Boeing Co, alleging the plane had crashed due to mechanical failure.


Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 "Disappears" -- viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1706

Ribbeck is also representing 115 passengers in the crash of Asiana Airlines Flight 214 in San Francisco in July.


http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/ ... PP20140326


Both firms mentioned above quoted in this article:

If we don't have the 'black box' with all the critical information on it, or we don't have any part of the wreckage, it would be very hard to maintain a claim against Boeing in any court in the United States," said aviation attorney...


...an attorney at Ribbeck Law Chartered, a firm that specializes in aviation accident cases, said she believes based on her experience that families could receive between $400,000 and $3 million in damages.


http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/22/world/asi ... nes-plane/
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby Seneca on May 13th, 2014, 8:28 pm

hoi.polloi wrote: The reason we are meant to be scared off by the demonic nature of hijackers is so that we don't begin playing with the idea of hijacking aircraft to amass an army of airliners.
I thought I learned from this site that using airplanes as weapons is science fiction? What would happen with the passengers?

What about the "Austin suicide attack"? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Austin_suicide_attack) The guy Joseph Stack flying a plane in a IRS building. Was that for real? I am not good with photo's but even I can see his photo from the article seems tampered with, no? Image
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby Flabbergasted on May 13th, 2014, 8:48 pm

Yes, pictures of this "Joseph Stack" on Google are ridiculous, to say the least.

But now we know that light aircraft like this...
Image

...can cause massive destruction:
Image

In case you thought a commercial airliner can´t knock down a skyscraper or disappear into the ground. :rolleyes:
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Re: airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby simonshack on May 13th, 2014, 9:32 pm

Flabbergasted wrote:Yes, pictures of this "Joseph Stack" on Google are ridiculous, to say the least.

But now we know that light aircraft like this...

...can cause massive destruction:

In case you thought a commercial airliner can´t knock down a skyscraper or disappear into the ground. :rolleyes:


Woah! So Joe [st]Shack's[/st] -uh, I mean, Joe Stack's single-engine Piper crashed into façade A - and managed to set the entire B-façade on fire?

Image

Image
http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/0 ... blogs&_r=0

I'm flabbergasted!
Joe must have trained in one of those special terror flight schools in Florida! :lol:
Nice date for Stack-the-musician to commit suicide too: 2/18 (it's just gotta tune-in to 11, hasnt'it - or else one might suspect foul play... )
Oh - and the exact time that Stack's plane struck the IRS building is reported as "9:56". I kid you not.

*************
My favorite excerpts from Stack's Wickedpedia page:

"His suicide note included not only criticism of the Federal Aviation Administration and the George W. Bush administration, but also a call for violent revolt."
(...)
The suicide note ended with:
“I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let’s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.
The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed."
–Joe Stack (1956-2010), 02/18/2010


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Austin_suicide_attack


A fine philosopher Stack was! He will be truly missed by all un-gullible folks out there! :P

*****

edit to add:

Oh my gosh. Talking about philosophers... Even the Great Thinker Noam Chomsky has weighed in on Stack's deed:

"Noted libertarian socialist American intellectual Noam Chomsky cited Joe Stack's suicide letter as indicative of some of the public sentiment in the U.S., stated that several of Stack's assertions are accurate or based on real grievances, and urged people to "help" the Joseph Stacks of the world get involved in constructive popular movements instead of letting the Joseph Stacks "destroy themselves, and maybe the world," in order to prevent a process similar to how legitimate and valid popular grievances of the German people in the 1920s and 1930s were manipulated by the Nazis towards violence and away from constructive ends."


Watch out! The Stacks of this world may destroy this world altogether! :rolleyes:
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Re: Airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby hoi.polloi on May 14th, 2014, 4:10 am

Wow, Simon, that's ridiculous!

Seneca wrote:
hoi.polloi wrote: The reason we are meant to be scared off by the demonic nature of hijackers is so that we don't begin playing with the idea of hijacking aircraft to amass an army of airliners.
I thought I learned from this site that using airplanes as weapons is science fiction? What would happen with the passengers?


What do you mean? You don't think crashing an airliner would cause terror and mayhem? Of course it would. It just wouldn't breach the physical laws of our universe as they have done in the Nutwork's phantasy phlights. And it would probably require extreme anti-security measures to even take control for any variety of reasons, let alone do something so unrealistic and dumb like crash it, or else they would have us (righteous) paranoids believing it would. You have to look at it from their perspective. Not the burlingame plotters but the stooges and pawns that go along with it all. The numerous security agents and marketers are gleefully caught up in the myth that everyone is a potential psychopathic boogieman or dictator of a new conceptual nation. Whether they really believe it or not.

So by their logic, the most "logical" of their motivations (ignoring for a moment the fact that they are actually some of the most seemingly deranged and twisted people out there) is to create the disasters they wish to scare people away from.

Another security agency argument is entrapment. There are laws against it, but if you talk to many police officers in the United States they will cheerily explain why entrapment is one of their favorite strategies for reaching quota, when they can get away with it. So baiting people with successful hijacking stories or other criminal stories is an attempt to catch anyone with any real plot involving illegal activities. From "their" perspective — those who are brainwashed and not fully in the know or disallowing their conscious conscientious mind from accepting it.

So in my opinion, one of the functions of these stories is to employ the security apparatus army we presently have scanning and fondling our privates at the airport.

As for the larger picture of why that is going on, I guess we could do our meager best at having a look at larger patterns?

I feel I can only assume that many of these burlingame writers consider themselves intellectually superior to you and me, rather than being able to communicate at an honest level. Either that or they have a special brand of retardation that prevents them from honest intellectual debate about major issues, and they require grandiose hoaxes to prove their points. If so, and we give them the benefit of the doubt about their motivations, they have a fairly paternal attitude in making suggestions to us through human thinkdanks like Noam Chomsky. On the other hand, are they correct? People can seem pretty darn dense and stubborn about many issues. But are they really? Or is it also a consequence of the abusive way we are treated by the hoaxers? We could try giving honesty and truth from our self-proclaimed "leaders" a chance, for goodness sakes. How long has it been since we tried that? Hundreds of years? Ever?

What we need to do is open some kind of two-way channel between CluesForum curious folks and the Kings of the Nutwork hobodom, so we can share knowledge. Presuming they even have any and they aren't just pretending to be concerned!
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Re: Airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby Seneca on May 14th, 2014, 9:20 am

Wow, I just have "discovered" my first media hoax on my own so to speak. I do not mean I was the first but I mean that nobody did suggest to me it was a hoax and I found the fake picture myself. Thanks cluesforum! I am eternally grateful for what I am learning here.
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Re: Airplanes and hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby simonshack on May 14th, 2014, 3:08 pm

*

TWA 800, JAMES KALLSTROM - and the "700 eyewitnesses"

Image

The TWA 800 was the story about a 747 Boeing which allegedly fell out of the sky on July 17, 1996 (that is, 1883 days prior to 9/11). As the story went, 230 people on board were killed, "the third-deadliest aviation accident to occur in U.S. territory". Now, as some will remember, the central controversy surrounding this (non?-)event, complete with sinister conspiracy-theories, was that hundreds of onlookers had witnessed the incident with their own eyes. In total (depending on which articles you may bump into) as many as 670 / or 700 people were able to catch a glimpse of the plane as it fell out of the sky. Of these, we were told, about 250 said they thought a missile had struck the plane. (Basic / primordial question: how often do YOU look up at random commercial airplanes flying in the sky above you?)

To make a long story short, James Kallstrom (then an assistant FBI-director in charge of the investigations) finally ruled that the "missile-eyewitness-reports" could not be trusted (causing a stir among the "conspiracy-theorist-crowd") and that no foul play was involved. What a story, eh? Well, here's my humble / if rather blunt take on this infamous airplane-disaster-tale ridden with the ubiquitous 'magic numbers' and oozing with pre-9/11 stench (so pardon the 'over-simplification' - but I hope that it will make sound sense to the readers of this forum).

The TWA 800 story was a 'general drill', a rehearsal of sorts in anticipation of the Grand 9/11 Psyop (what with its reliance on bystanders/ 'firsthand eyewitnesses' to sell the story) as well as a 'test-run' of the web of complicit 'civilian' agencies and 'Hollywood-crews' involved (NTSB, FAA, "grieving-family-members"-Crisis-Actors etc...). Moreover, it was designed to seed / implant in the public's consciousness the following notions:

A: "A short-lived airplane disaster WILL be witnessed by hundreds of people / sky-watchers."
B: "Even so, witness reports of such a brief event MAY or MAY NOT be a reliable source of information."
C: "At the end of the day, what REALLY matters is the official investigation - and there's nothing Joe Public can do about it."

To be sure, this Kallstrom character is featured in my September Clues (at the 24min mark) as he was interviewed "LIVE on CNN" on 9/11 by Aaron Brown (and later, also by Peter Jennings on ABC). But there's more: Kallstrom is also featured (as the main host / narrator) of a movie made in 1999 about the first "1993 WTC Bombing" : http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1202985/ful ... t_ov_st_sm

So I think we can safely throw this Kallstrom character straight into our wastebasket of 9/11 hoax Supporting Clowns.


A few quick TWA 800 (media-reported) factoids:

"It was a muggy night when TWA Flight 800 left JFK airport at 8:19 p.m., bound for Paris. Eleven minutes after takeoff [at 8:30], the jetliner vanished from radar." (crashing into the sea, 9 miles off the shore of East Moriches, Long Island.)

"James Kallstrom was an assistant director of the FBI at the time of the TWA Flight 800 crash. He was in charge of the New York office and was assigned to head up the exhaustive investigation. He made a commitment to the families of victims to leave no stone unturned and to his friend and FBI colleague whose wife was a flight attendant on the plane."

"Initially, there was the thought that it may have been an act of terror, but that theory dissipated as hard evidence was recovered."

"It was a little over a year after the crash that the FBI ruled that there was no criminal act that destroyed the plane. But that finding has never satisfied the conspiracy theorists who claim TWA 800 was destroyed by a missile. Over 250 people said they saw something streaking toward the plane before the explosion. To date, no substantive evidence has been produced to support their belief."

http://pix11.com/local-news/stories/twa ... z31gdjmaIM


From Wickedpedia - we have more 9/11 magic numbers (... as much as this sickening and tiresome 'esoteric' stuff makes me cringe in pain - augh !):

"The last recorded radar transponder return from the airplane was recorded by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) radar site at Trevose, Pennsylvania at 20:31:12 (total= 9). Thirty-eight (11) seconds later, the captain of an Eastwind Airlines Boeing 737 reported to Boston ARTCC that he "just saw an explosion out here", adding, "we just saw an explosion up ahead of us here...about 16,000 feet or something like that, it just went down into the water." "



******

And, if you can bother to read this other absurd - yet telling - Wickedpedia extract concerning the TWA 800 eyewitnesses, here you go:


Witness interviews

Most witnesses to the accident had seen a "streak of light" that was unanimously described as ascending, moving to a point where a large fireball appeared, with several witnesses reporting that the fireball split in two as it descended toward the water. There was intense public interest in these witness reports and much speculation that the reported streak of light was a missile that had struck TWA 800, causing the airplane to explode.These witness accounts were a major reason for the initiation and duration of the FBI's criminal investigation.

Approximately 80 FBI agents conducted interviews with potential witnesses daily. No verbatim records of the witness interviews were produced; instead, the agents who conducted the interviews wrote summaries that they then submitted. Witnesses were not asked to review or correct the summaries. Included in some of the witness summaries were drawings or diagrams of what the witness observed. Witnesses were not allowed to testify at the court hearings.

Within days of the crash the NTSB announced its intent to form its own witness group and to interview witnesses to the crash. However, after the FBI raised concerns about non-governmental parties in the NTSB's investigation having access to this information and possible prosecutorial difficulties resulting from multiple interviews of the same witness, the NTSB deferred and did not interview witnesses to the crash. A Safety Board investigator later reviewed FBI interview notes and briefed other Board investigators on their contents. In November 1996, the FBI agreed to allow the NTSB access to summaries of witness accounts in which personally identifying information had been redacted and to conduct a limited number of witness interviews. In April 1998, the FBI provided the NTSB with the identities of the witnesses but due to the time elapsed a decision was made to rely on the original FBI documents rather than reinterview witnesses.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TWA_800


So - basically - all those "TWA 800 eyewitnesses" were, and remain to this day, anonymous entities. Marvellous, isn't it?
.
Image

A bunch of BC? It sure is, Mr Kallstrom, it sure is - and your ass stinks to high heaven! <_<
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Re: Airplanes hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby simonshack on May 16th, 2014, 11:41 pm

*

I wasn't quite aware that Jim Kallstrom actually "ran the 9/11 probe" - nor that he was also a 'classmate' of that Ken Feinberg guy.

ImageImage

But that's what it says here on the Boston Globe:
http://www.bostonglobe.com/magazine/spe ... story.html
The article is about three fellow UMass Amherst alumni who all "SHONE AFTER 9/11"...

Interesting. This is not my find - it's by seu bobo over at Fetzer's comment sections.

Funnily enough, I happened to find that Jim Kallstrom also shares honors (as a "trustee emeritus") with our ol' friend Howard Lutnick - at the INTREPID MUSEUM. The latter is (believe it or not) also a Vice Chairman of the famous Air & Space museum : :wacko:

Jim Kallstrom / Howard Lutnick
ImageImage
http://www.intrepidmuseum.org/about-us/trustees.aspx

"The Intrepid Sea, Air & Space Museum is the only museum where visitors can experience a legendary aircraft carrier, the first space shuttle, the world’s fastest jets, and a Cold War-era [nuclear] submarine."

ImageImage


Go figure...

And pardon me - but what is this all about? Howard Lutnick, "the Cantor Fitzgerald CEO" - honored by the NAVY ???

"Mr. Lutnick received the US Department of the Navy's Distinguished Public Service Award, the highest honor granted by the Navy to non-military personnel."
http://ebookbrowsee.net/howard-lutnick- ... d133052145

I give up... I probably have no clue of how America works... Bankers being awarded Distinguished Navy honors? Good grief. ^_^


*******
Sorry for slight derailing of thread - but it all started with TWA 800 - and Jim Kallstrom's central role in that story. In any case, it would seem to emerge that the "Hoaxing Business Cartel" (behind airplane dramas, space feats, nuke fears, terror attacks and all) is pretty much a "family affair".
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Re: Airplanes hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby simonshack on May 22nd, 2014, 6:04 pm

*

A FEW MORE TWA 800 ('nine-eleven') FACTOIDS

I just found out that, as the story goes, there was a total of 38 (including the Jumbo's crew of 18) TWA employees on the doomed TWA 800 flight. This means that one in six passengers (38 out of 230) on that plane were TWA people. Alright, so one may say this isn't overly strange or suspicious (as employees of any given airline are probably frequent freebie fliers on their own carriers). However, I thought it was a factoid worth pointing out - were it only for the ubiquitous 'magic numerology' involved (3+8=11 and 1+8=9)...


Sandra Aikens-Bellamy, 49, off-duty TWA employee
Rosie Braman-Mosberg, 47, off-duty TWA employee
Dan J. Callas, TWA Crew
Richard Campbell, 63, TWA Flight Engineer
Paula Carven and son Jay, 9, off duty TWA flight attendant
Jacques and Connie Charbonnier, 66 and 47, working FSM and F/A
Janet Christopher, 48 TWA 800 crew
Debra DiLuccio, 47, TWA 800 crew
Warren Dodge, TWA 800 crew
Daryl Edwards, 41, off-duty TWA service supervisor
Douglas Eshleman, 35, off-duty Flight Engineer
Ana Gough, off-duty TWA flight attendant
Joanne Griffith, 39, off-duty TWA employee
Erik Harkness, 23, off-duty TWA employee
James Hull, 48, TWA 800 crew
Lonnie Ingenhuett, 43, TWA 800 crew
Arlene Johnsen, 60, TWA 800 crew
Capt. Ralph Kevorkian, 58, TWA 800 crew
Oliver Krick, 25, TWA 800 engineer
Barbara Kwan, 40, TWA 800 crew
Ray Lang, 51, TWA 800 crew
Maureen Lockhart, 49, TWA 800 crew
Elaine Loffredo, 50, TWA 800 crew
Eli Luevano, 42, TWA 800 crew
Pam McPherson, 45, TWA 800 crew
Grace Melotin, 48, TWA 800 crew
Gideon Miller, 57, off-duty TWA pilot
Marit Rhoads, 48, TWA 800 crew
Mike Schuldt, 51, TWA 800 crew
Capt. Steve Snyder, 57, TWA 800 flight crew
Rick Verhaeghe, 48, TWA 800 first officer
Lani Warren, 48, FSM TWA 800 crew
Jill Ziemkiewicz, 24, TWA 800 crew, 96-hire, her first and last Int'l flight.

SOURCE. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/na ... list01.htm


Now, since the TWA 800 flight (which, we are told, crashed 11 minutes after taking off from the JFK airport) was bound for Rome (via Paris), the purported airline disaster was big news in Italy at the time. I've been looking back at some old Italian news articles - which feature endless controversy regarding the exact number of Italian victims (apparently, there were "three different boarding lists which caused dire confusion in the TWA offices"). Well, to make a long story short, the Italian Foreign ministry eventually released this official communiqué:

Un' ora piu' tardi scende dal quinto piano del ministero degli Esteri un consigliere per precisare che la TWA ha fornito un elenco con undici [eleven] nomi e cognomi italiani.
http://archiviostorico.corriere.it/1996 ... 9111.shtml


That's right. "Eleven Italian TWA 800 casualties" was the officially released figure.
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Re: Airplanes hoaxes/conspiracies

Postby simonshack on May 30th, 2014, 1:55 am

*

OCCAM'S RAZOR - and TWA 800

Here is an image extracted from a TV newscast which purports to show the TWA 800 wreckage (as it was fished out from the sea):

Image
At 3:06 of this TV broadcast; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qloQKeM-xNI

As you can clearly see, the rightmost tire in this picture has no rim. Now, I trust that no one will hazard to believe that the tire of an airplane's landing gear might possibly lose its rim - not even in the most explosive of accidents (with the tire remaining pretty much intact).

So, I'll make no apology for bluntly stating that this lone, single image proves beyond doubt that the TWA 800 event was a hoax. See, in MY world (I don't know about yours - and certainly do not pretend to speak for it!) this is a most egregious, "slam dunk" example of what is known as an incontrovertible Occam's Razor proof.

In fact, the most simple (Occam's Razor) explanation of what we are looking at here is:

WE ARE LOOKING AT A RIMLESS TIRE WHICH WAS RETRIEVED FROM A JUNK YARD - IN ORDER TO STAGE THE TWA 800 WRECKAGE. WHOEVER SUPERVISED THE COLLECTION OF THOSE CINEMA-PROPS TO BE USED AS "PROOF" OF THE TWA 800 DISASTER WAS AN INEPT / STUPID PERSON.

I dearly hope that most Cluesforum readers will agree with my above logic - and conclusions.


*************

In fact, on 9/11 this other rim-less tire was also shown on TV - and presented as "evidence of an airplane crashing into WTC2" :

Image
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