Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it really?

Global War deceptions & mass manipulation, fear-mongering terror schemes and propaganda in the Age of the Bomb

Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby bostonterrierowner on July 14th, 2011, 8:55 am

Moro's case is just unbelievable . Prodi , psychics , commies , fascists , masons , ruskies , yankees ,vatican , pope , bishops , kgb , cia . :) Its all there . I need to wrap my mind around it and I think in the first place Red Brigades should be taken a closer look at.
NoHo , as an Itaian , do you seriously think that Prodi is/was a KGB asset?

corsarino wrote:
Brigate Rosse is a fake group; at the end of WWII there was Brigate Nere (Fascist) Brigate Azzurre (Monarchic) Brigate Bianche (Democristiani), Commie were GAP (Gruppi di aziione Partigiana); who decided the name of Brigate Rosse was a man who knew the facts of 1944-1945 (Yalta year)


Could you please be more generous with us on the subject ? :)
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby corsarino on July 14th, 2011, 5:58 pm

At the end of 1943 Allen Dulles ( USA) and John MCcaffery (UK) organized the “colored revolution”; against the “Brigate Nere” (black= Fascist)they helped the other colored Brigades with money, arms ammunitions and other products.

Other colors were : Bianche (white= Christian) , Azzurre (light Blue= Monarchic), Garibaldi (Socialist and Communist), Franchi (liberal).

The method used Dulles and Mccaffery was simply “Divide et Impera”; the simplest way to divide was the use of color. Impera was a must for USA and UK.

In those years, there were no Red Brigades.

Twenty- five years later, Usa and Uk started the “Strategy of tension”; The objective was to “divide” the Italian people in order to get a bigger power (Impera).

So they financed a new brigade : “Brigate Rosse” to use for false flag operation.

Edgardo Sogno, leader of Franchi Brigate, started in 1970, the "Comitati di Resistenza Democratica" with MCcaffery's son using money from USA and intelligence from London.
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby bostonterrierowner on July 19th, 2011, 3:21 pm

Gianni Giansanti , a photographer responsible for dead Moro's body's in trunk picture was just 22 and in the very beginning of his career. He later became John Paul II's photographer taking the pictures of his assassination attempt.

John Paul II is a taboo subject in Poland , one can only worship the pontiff :) But thank goodness for this forum. What if his assassination attempt was bogus? If it was maybe Moro's was as well ?


regards
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby simonshack on July 19th, 2011, 8:29 pm

bostonterrierowner wrote:Gianni Giansanti , a photographer responsible for dead Moro's body's in trunk picture was just 22 and in the very beginning of his career.


Dear BTO,

Gianni Giansanti's (who died on March 18, 2009) still has this website up : http://www.giansanti.com/archive.asp
I will soon put together a post about this extraordinary photographer.

*******************************

Dear Nonho,

Did you know (have you ever heard about) this 'info' about Moro? :huh: :blink:
"The five time premier of Italy had been kidnapped by the radicals of the Red Brigade and, after 54 days in captivity, executed with 11 gunshots to his heart."

TIME MAGAZINE article: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 63,00.html
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby nonhocapito on July 19th, 2011, 9:42 pm

simonshack wrote:
bostonterrierowner wrote:Gianni Giansanti , a photographer responsible for dead Moro's body's in trunk picture was just 22 and in the very beginning of his career.


Dear BTO,

Gianni Giansanti's (who died on March 18, 2009) still has this website up : http://www.giansanti.com/archive.asp
I will soon put together a post about this extraordinary photographer.

*******************************

Dear Nonho,

Did you know (have you ever heard about) this 'info' about Moro? :huh: :blink:
"The five time premier of Italy had been kidnapped by the radicals of the Red Brigade and, after 54 days in captivity, executed with 11 gunshots to his heart."

TIME MAGAZINE article: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 63,00.html


I couldn't find anywhere on my books the number of bullets used to kill Moro. I can tell you that the days of captivity were 55, and that apparently he was executed first with the burst of a silenced submachine gun "Skorpion" 7.65 near his heart, and then finished with a Walter "ppk" caliber 9. It is not known who fired the shots (nobody took responsibility).

I am, poor me, re-reading things about Moro these days, and especially about Mario Moretti, Edgardo Sogno and the RB. I'll post something soon. Anyway I can tell you that the more I read the more I remain convinced that the Moro assassination was real and not fake.
I will even say that I don't think the italian media in the seventies were anywhere near being completely under control like they are today, like the U.S. media were on 9/11 and so forth, even if the masonic lodge P2 was active and infiltrated in every level of the italian establishment. I just don't see fakery of these proportions to happen in that context.

I imagine cases like Moro's to be on the list of terror acts that eventually convinced the elites to simulate rather than do, because the Moro case proves that too many things can go wrong, and proves that the victims' families can be a pain. Moro's family was a pain, bugging the powers on every possible occasion to find more about the real events that caused Moro's death. As to the things that went wrong during the kidnapping and had to be corrected on the run, leaving fingerprints and smudges, the list is so long it would take a separate thread to go over it.

A lot in the Moro story was manipulated, a lot was faked, by I am quite convinced that Moro was held by an infiltrated organization called Red Brigades and "executed". At most, I could allow this idea: that as a part of the bargaining during the captivity, Moro's life was spared as long as he accepted to fake his death and disappear, maybe in a monastery or abroad. In which case, pictures of his body would be fake. This is possible, as long as we allow for the rest of the story, the ambush, the kidnapping, the Red Brigades being instrumental in the process, to be real.

For the time being I find this explanation not supported by much evidence. Except maybe just the fact that we have letters by Moro, dated around the last days of captivity that seem to talk about his promised liberation. These letters have been explained away by the RB and the media as a trickery played on Moro for some reason. But they could be a sign of an accord reached in that sense. I'll try to find out more on this.
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby corsarino on July 19th, 2011, 9:55 pm

@BTO

I don't think Gianni Giansanti were in S.Peter Square on May 13 1981. May be i'm wrong.


I think that Via Caetani is the master key to understand the Moro Case; in that street there was a "safe house" for OSS agent in 1944; Peter Tompkins, Oss agent, used the nickname "Camillo Caetani"in 1944; and so on.

Pecorelli wrote about "a two lions road access", the court at Via delle Botteghe Oscure 32 / Via Caetani.

The Italian State Police stated that R4 moved for only 50 meters with the body inside; that car was covered by pieces of clothes (nearby there is Botteghe Oscure (Black Shops)).
Savasta (RB executive) testimonied that he got "his" R4 to a Car Wash, in order to clean it.
So there are two R4s: one (the clean one) for RB executive, and another one (the dirty one) for the"real group".
So RB are patsy; the real group was another one.
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby nonhocapito on July 19th, 2011, 10:12 pm

corsarino wrote:I think that Via Caetani is the master key to understand the Moro Case; in that street there was a "safe house" for OSS agent in 1944; Peter Tompkins, Oss agent, used the nickname "Camillo Caetani"in 1944; and so on.
Pecorelli wrote about "a two lions road access", the court at Via delle Botteghe Oscure 32 / Via Caetani.


It was one of the many psychics consulted by Cossiga during the kidnapping that had spoken about the entrance with the two lions, while Pecorelli had hinted that the prison was "in the ghetto". The only psychic they consulted who held some credit, the french-jewish character Gerard Croiset http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerard_Croiset, had come up with a different clue: "Civitella Paganica", that roughly could be translated "Pagan Citadel". Via Paganica and Piazza Paganica, in Rome, are located in the old jewish ghetto. In the hideout in Via Gradoli the police found blueprints drawn by RB Morucci of an apartment located in via Montesavello in the ghetto, with a mysterious indications for a drug, atropine... I am not sure the OSS is the way to explain the ghetto though. The CIA had certainly the means to use hideouts all over Rome or Italy. I think the ghetto was a message and not an incidental one. As it was the day in 1974 when "by accident" after an RB attack Moretti distributed a leaflet where the RB five-pointed stars was drawn with six points... After that episode the RB leaders were "officially" offered by the Mossad weapons and money. At that time, the help was refused, until a few years later Moretti became the only leader of the group...

[EDIT: by browsing around the ghetto with google street view, the only palace I found with two lions on the front was the Christian party headquarters palace. See a few posts below for more.]
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby corsarino on July 19th, 2011, 10:20 pm

The RB Comunicato N.1 was left in a pedestrian subway at Largo Argentina, (200 meters from Via Caetani).
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby bostonterrierowner on July 19th, 2011, 10:37 pm

corsarino wrote:@BTO

I don't think Gianni Giansanti were in S.Peter Square on May 13 1981. May be i'm wrong.



No you are not , I was :) Sorry for confusion

while he was on the other side of Rome when the attempt was made on the Pope's life, Giansanti was among the photographers at Rebibbia prison when John Paul went to forgive his would-be assassin, Mehmet Ali Agca

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... z1Sac2unYK
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby nonhocapito on July 19th, 2011, 10:45 pm

corsarino wrote:The Italian State Police stated that R4 moved for only 50 meters with the body inside; that car was covered by pieces of clothes (nearby there is Botteghe Oscure (Black Shops)).


Yes there were fibers of clothes inside the car and on the body of Moro, and on the inside of the fenders (so not the kind of dirt you necessarily wash away with a car wash... but interesting details anyway...).

They also found traces of sand coming from a particular area of the Lazio shore, were in fact apparently the RB had a base. Ludicrously, the RB explained the sand as a diversion, while the investigators now suggest Moro was held for part of the time outside Rome somewhere along the coasts towards Fiumicino. Interestingly there on the shore was located a very old WWF center, connected to the Caetani family (the same one after which was named the street in Rome, and the palazzo in it). As to the fibers of clothes, the ghetto was and is filled with clothing shops, and one big clothing warehouse was located in via Caetani itself... what a messy story :D
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby nonhocapito on July 19th, 2011, 11:23 pm

I made a little map for the readers confused by all these italian locations names... :P

Image
I'll call this picture "The Pagan Citadel"

You can locate these streets on google maps here: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=41 ... 5&t=h&z=16

All these could be meaningless clues, but, regarding the whereabouts of Moro's prison in the last days... As you can see the body of Moro, the PCI and DC headquarters make for a perfect triangle. Whatever that means. In google street view you can see that at the center of that triangle is a big condominium with two angels on the front door and a fabric shop at the ground floor. The condo is right at the back of the christian party HD, sharing the courtyard with it (the christian party HD entrance, on the other side of the block has two lions heads next to it). For those of you who like to think the Jesuits at the center of every conspiracy, I'll note that the mother church of the Company of Jesus (a masterpiece of early baroque) is located right there in the square at the top of the triangle.

Image
Entrance to the building at the "center of the triangle"

Image
Entrance to the Christian Party Headquarters, with two winged lionish heads next to it

Also as a bonus:

Image
Haberdashery in Piazza Paganica. One of the many fabric-related stores in the area.
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby corsarino on July 20th, 2011, 1:44 pm

The opposite front of the "Merceria" is the Enciclopedia Italiana Building, in Piazza dell'Enciclopedia Italiana.

The Enciclopedia Italiana Building is the "other" front of "Isola Mattei" (Mattei Block) which is delimited by Via Caetani, Via delle Botteghe Oscure, Piazza dell'Enciclopedia Italiana and Via de Funari.

The President of the Enciclopedia Italiana was in a steering committee for Moro case together with Pieczenick, Ferracuti, Cossiga.

1-st RB Bulletin was left in south side of Largo Argentina; That pedestrian subway does'nt exist nowadays; it was at the angle of Via Floridia, Via Arenula.

Julius Caesar was killed at Theatre of Pompeo in Largo Argentina at Idi of March; Moro was kidnapped at idi of March (16 March!) and killed in Theatre of Balbo (Via Caetani).
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby nonhocapito on July 20th, 2011, 2:21 pm

Thanks corsarino I seemed to remember the Treccani entering into it! (For the non-italian reader, The Treccani encyclopedia is the italian equivalent of the Britannica)... Also interesting about theater Balbo. I think I was going out of track focusing north of Botteghe Oscure. I think Pecorelli too linked a mysterious "duchess" involved in the Moro affair, to the ruins of the Balbo Theater...

I read in the past about Igor Markevitch (married Caetani) being one of the links between the RB and Gladio... I just always found that storyline a bit frustrating, missing as it does so many details.
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby corsarino on July 20th, 2011, 7:55 pm

@nonhocapito

what about a drink at Le Bain BAR Via delle Botteghe Oscure, 33?

ciao
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Re: Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it rea

Postby simonshack on July 20th, 2011, 10:40 pm

corsarino wrote:@nonhocapito

what about a drink at Le Bain BAR Via delle Botteghe Oscure, 33?

ciao


Hehe - I'll be joining you if Nonho can make it. Do you mind?

Meanwhile, you guys HAVE to watch this.

I vari TG sconvolgentemente imbarazzanti annunciando il ritrovamento di 'un cadavere in una macchina notato da alcumi passanti' ( "Lo dice l'ANSA ma noi, di preciso, ne sappiamo ancora ben poco, eh!" ...) :unsure: :

E Vespa è in gran forma! :lol: ("Ah... ecco! L'uomo morto è...Moro!")

full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV9V7R6F2pM

(sorry folks - for Italian speakers only...)
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