The Holocaust Under Review
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THE DERAILING ROOM
*
Admin notice (inserted into this earlier post by "Matt Marriott") - by Simon Shack - Feb 17, 2012
THE DERAILING ROOM
This thread will be the receptacle of ALL forum postings which the Cluesforum administrators will deem irrelevant/not pertinent to any given forum thread. Whenever a post/or a series of posts appear to stray/deviate/digress from the subject of any given forum discussion, they will be moved over here.
This does not necessarily mean that the discussion material moved over here is in itself uninteresting - or unworthy of attention. In fact, some of it may be particularly acute/trailblazing/pioneering - and fully pertinent to the prime scope of this forum: to expose the rampant media deceptions of our world - and all their related corrolaries.
However, I trust everyone will understand and appreciate our wish to keep any given forum topic free of unrelated posts and undue digressions. Undoubtedly - and inevitably - this DERAILING ROOM itself will eventually grow into a hodgepodge of disconnected topics - yet any observant member will be able to make out (thanks to the headline/title featured on the top of each post) exactly where any given post originated.
Thanks for everyone's kind comprehension
Simon Shack
PS: If any given subject found in the DERAILING ROOM is deemed important by a Cluesforum member, he/she is free to open a new topic in the appropriate forum section. It will be, as always, moderated for relevance by the forum administrators - and kept running if deemed adequately researched and documented.
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(Earlier post by Matt Marriott starts below):
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From patsy McVeigh to pure virtual characters, 15 years later in Germany's 2009 school masscre (1) and beyond that, 16 years later in the US, to not only pure virtual character Jareed Loughner, created based on Glenn Beck (2), but also both times to pure virtual massacres. (3)
As for Brevink the illuminati use a "complex" (4) combination, with three diferent faces presented as early as 25 July 2011, with the climax not on February 6 2012, as they show for the first time footage of "killer" (5), but much earlier, on 25 July 2011, when besides reducing the number of "victims" of the Utoya island "shooting" from 90 to 68, the illuminati set another milestone in the impersonation type of jokes: they present simultaneously the third face and footage of the real person used to create that face. And that is ... the norwegian policeman at the press conference (6).
Notes
(1) http://citizens-disarmed.blogspot.com/2 ... ed-to.html
(2)- why do the illuminati use a photo of Glenn Beck to photoshop pure virtual "shooter" "Jared Lee Loughner" in the pure virtual Arizona "shootings"? Answer: illuminati religion.
http://illuminati-religion.blogspot.com/
(3) Norway bombing and "shooting" = 911 without victims (except for one girl from Iraq and the stepbrother of crown princess Mette-Maritt)
(4) The illuminati first suggested that the first face, younger but not too different the second face released July 23, wearing the traditional Masonic apron of the Norwegian Order of Freemasons and posing with guns, were also pure virtual characters.
(5) More precisely of the second face used to impersonate the "killer". This fact immediately reveals that the first face (younger look) that was released was a creation photoshopped from this real second face.
(6) 25 July 2011, press conference with three norwegian policemen.
(1): they present a third face used to represent the "shooter", his photo inside a police car supposedly on his way to the court.
As this photo of this new third face is presented, the screen shows only one "other" person: one of the three policemen.
Why? Again the answer to explain these illuminati jokles is the same: the illuminati religion.
Admin notice (inserted into this earlier post by "Matt Marriott") - by Simon Shack - Feb 17, 2012
THE DERAILING ROOM
This thread will be the receptacle of ALL forum postings which the Cluesforum administrators will deem irrelevant/not pertinent to any given forum thread. Whenever a post/or a series of posts appear to stray/deviate/digress from the subject of any given forum discussion, they will be moved over here.
This does not necessarily mean that the discussion material moved over here is in itself uninteresting - or unworthy of attention. In fact, some of it may be particularly acute/trailblazing/pioneering - and fully pertinent to the prime scope of this forum: to expose the rampant media deceptions of our world - and all their related corrolaries.
However, I trust everyone will understand and appreciate our wish to keep any given forum topic free of unrelated posts and undue digressions. Undoubtedly - and inevitably - this DERAILING ROOM itself will eventually grow into a hodgepodge of disconnected topics - yet any observant member will be able to make out (thanks to the headline/title featured on the top of each post) exactly where any given post originated.
Thanks for everyone's kind comprehension
Simon Shack
PS: If any given subject found in the DERAILING ROOM is deemed important by a Cluesforum member, he/she is free to open a new topic in the appropriate forum section. It will be, as always, moderated for relevance by the forum administrators - and kept running if deemed adequately researched and documented.
***************************************************************************************************************************************************
(Earlier post by Matt Marriott starts below):
***************************************************************************************************************************************************
From patsy McVeigh to pure virtual characters, 15 years later in Germany's 2009 school masscre (1) and beyond that, 16 years later in the US, to not only pure virtual character Jareed Loughner, created based on Glenn Beck (2), but also both times to pure virtual massacres. (3)
As for Brevink the illuminati use a "complex" (4) combination, with three diferent faces presented as early as 25 July 2011, with the climax not on February 6 2012, as they show for the first time footage of "killer" (5), but much earlier, on 25 July 2011, when besides reducing the number of "victims" of the Utoya island "shooting" from 90 to 68, the illuminati set another milestone in the impersonation type of jokes: they present simultaneously the third face and footage of the real person used to create that face. And that is ... the norwegian policeman at the press conference (6).
Notes
(1) http://citizens-disarmed.blogspot.com/2 ... ed-to.html
(2)- why do the illuminati use a photo of Glenn Beck to photoshop pure virtual "shooter" "Jared Lee Loughner" in the pure virtual Arizona "shootings"? Answer: illuminati religion.
http://illuminati-religion.blogspot.com/
(3) Norway bombing and "shooting" = 911 without victims (except for one girl from Iraq and the stepbrother of crown princess Mette-Maritt)
(4) The illuminati first suggested that the first face, younger but not too different the second face released July 23, wearing the traditional Masonic apron of the Norwegian Order of Freemasons and posing with guns, were also pure virtual characters.
(5) More precisely of the second face used to impersonate the "killer". This fact immediately reveals that the first face (younger look) that was released was a creation photoshopped from this real second face.
(6) 25 July 2011, press conference with three norwegian policemen.
(1): they present a third face used to represent the "shooter", his photo inside a police car supposedly on his way to the court.
As this photo of this new third face is presented, the screen shows only one "other" person: one of the three policemen.
Why? Again the answer to explain these illuminati jokles is the same: the illuminati religion.
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Let put the thing straight. Stalin made up the number 4 million “Jews” killed in Auschwitz in purpose to hide his own killings. Same as it was with Katyn. I don't know who increased it to 6 million.
However there was verification in Poland in 1993. After research they said that the most possible number is 1 million. We talking about a single camp, and only about “Jews”. Lets count. It was physically possible to cremate 1000 corpes per day. Let’s say that Germans were very well organized, and began mass murdering straight away even if credible historical sources say that real extermination began in 1943.
Okay, so we've got 30,000 per month, times 60 months = 1,8 million. I do not have any doubt that gas chambers never existed, but I believe there was a mass murdering of “Jews”. And the word Holocaust means to burn the whole. So, to say that Holocaust never happened must be followed by explanation.
The sensible thing to say is lots of “Jews” died in camps, the number was big, and Hitler really wanted to kill as many “Jews” as possible. Not even a million was possible. Not even one in the gas chamber. I think that experiments with highly poisonous and explosive gas without a proper place to do so is rather not an option to consider.
However there was verification in Poland in 1993. After research they said that the most possible number is 1 million. We talking about a single camp, and only about “Jews”. Lets count. It was physically possible to cremate 1000 corpes per day. Let’s say that Germans were very well organized, and began mass murdering straight away even if credible historical sources say that real extermination began in 1943.
Okay, so we've got 30,000 per month, times 60 months = 1,8 million. I do not have any doubt that gas chambers never existed, but I believe there was a mass murdering of “Jews”. And the word Holocaust means to burn the whole. So, to say that Holocaust never happened must be followed by explanation.
The sensible thing to say is lots of “Jews” died in camps, the number was big, and Hitler really wanted to kill as many “Jews” as possible. Not even a million was possible. Not even one in the gas chamber. I think that experiments with highly poisonous and explosive gas without a proper place to do so is rather not an option to consider.
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*Farcevalue wrote:After spending some time with this forum I have come to doubt nearly everything I have been told by anyone who didn't see it first hand, and that while taking into account the credibility of the observer. Nearly everything that comes across the airwaves and film projectors has spin, from cowboys and indians, to WWII and heroic John Wayne (hero of both genres), to those heartless Asians and now the extremist Muslims.
Yes, Farcevalue:
One thing I am glad to have (long) overcome, is the basic/bogus notion of "good guys" vs "bad guys" - in the context of what I was taught at school regarding the World Wars (the Allies & Americans being, of course, indoctrinated into my young, virginal brain - as "the good ones"). Now, without needing to be a "Nazi sympathizer" or a "Holocaust denier", it behooves every free thinker to ask him/herself just how far the WW winner's propaganda went - particularly in view of what we now know concerning Hollywood's profound and instrumental role in warfare - and the 'martial arts'...
Two war propaganda contraptions worth a closer scrutiny are "THE MARCH OF TIME" & "INSIDE NAZI GERMANY".
Here's a little 'taster' of the latter - a Time Inc-sponsored movie that clearly oozes of the very same 'totalitarian' propaganda that it purports to denounce in describing Hitler's Germany...
full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI7udRx5vpE
'Nazi' Concentration Camps on Staten Island?
by Hengist
In 1981, Jack Glenn, director of the popular 1940's newsreel series March of Time, died at age 76. His obituary, distributed by the Associated Press [and published in the Bergen, New Jersey, Sunday Record on February 15, 1981] let slip an amazing revelation:
"As senior director for the popular movie house newsreel, he often created world events with actors and movie sets. One such news feature film, Inside Nazi Germany, made in 1938, included footage of a "concentration camp" that was filmed on Staten Island with scores of New York City actors. Much of the film's footage was shot within the borders of the Third Reich by a free-lance cameraman, but [Louis] Rochement [Glenn's producer] felt that the film had been censored by the German authorities and ordered Glenn to re-enact widely reported Nazi camp atrocities."
Millions of Americans watching the "news"-reels in their local theatres were convinced that they were seeing "the real thing."
How many such images of "reality" that we see on a regular basis are actually the creation of movie magicians?
It is a fact that the Allies hired Hollywood directors to produce propaganda films after the war instead of using regular army footage.
http://www.fpp.co.uk/Auschwitz/docs/fake/GlennObit.html
And here's an extract from Richard Koszarski's "HOLLYWOOD ON THE HOUSTON" :
http://books.google.it/books?id=1NzOhgP ... on&f=false
So, if the Time Inc-sponsored "March of Time" newsreels went as far as faking concentration camp graveyards in their 'backyard' (Staten Island), one can only wonder how much else was staged by 'Hollywood' - in reporting/depicting the Nazi atrocities to the public. Again, this has nothing to do with outright 'Holocaust denial' - but the much touted '6 million' death toll certainly sounds like a fanciful, hollywodesque exaggeration.
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It is really astonishing to see how it appears normal now to describe the use of fakery in relation to the production of news, as long as they belong to the distant past. Matters little, apparently, if that distant past still affects us and is propagandized in our schools or broadcast by the media.simonshack wrote:So, if the Time Inc-sponsored "March of Time" newsreels went as far as faking concentration camp graveyards in their 'backyard' (Staten Island), one can only wonder how much else was staged by 'Hollywood' - in reporting/depicting the Nazi atrocities to the public. Again, this has nothing to do with outright 'Holocaust denial' - but the much touted '6 million' death toll certainly sounds like a fanciful, hollywodesque exaggeration.
Regarding the holocaust and the role of concentration camps, we are told that it was the Russian who uncovered first most of the concentration camps: especially and including Auschwitz. I think in fact that the famous newsreels of withered bodies pushed in common graves by caterpillars are Soviet reels.
If this is true, one cannot ignore the fact that Stalin's Russia was known for its intensive use of propaganda and fakery and the habit of lying to its citizens -- and also that Stalin himself is said to have been connected, like most of the Bolshevik establishment, to the european jewish elite. It is hence very possible to imagine that all the horrific stories about gas chambers and torture, and the incredible, exaggerated number of victims of the genocide, were in fact at first a product of Soviet propaganda, aimed (with the western propaganda ready to chime in) at exchanging favors with the powerful financial zionist elites of Europe who had financed winners and losers alike.
Later in Yalta further common decisions were probably taken in terms of what propaganda was to be fed to the respective nations.
p.s.: should we maybe change the title of this thread to something more generic and descriptive regarding fakery and the holocaust...?
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Re: "No holes, no Holocaust” The Victories of Revisionism
Yes - good idea! I'll let you choose the appropriate title, Nonho!nonhocapito wrote: p.s.: should we maybe change the title of this thread to something more generic and descriptive regarding fakery and the holocaust...?
Re: "No holes, no Holocaust” The Victories of Revisionism
"Holocaust: All the available footage is untrustworthy"simonshack wrote:Yes - good idea! I'll let you choose the appropriate title, Nonho!nonhocapito wrote: p.s.: should we maybe change the title of this thread to something more generic and descriptive regarding fakery and the holocaust...?
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Re: The Holocaust: propaganda, censorship and media fakery
Today is "Holocaust Remembrance Day" (other than being the anniversary of the Oklahoma bombing and the siege of Waco).
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/isr ... s-1.425268
Incidentally, there seem to be a lot of "Holocaust remembrance days": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_Remembrance_Day (April 19th is in relation to the Warsaw ghetto uprising: but it also coincides with 27 Nisan, Yom HaShoah, "Holocaust Day" in Israel and everywhere else.)
"On the morning of Yom HaShoah, a two minute siren sounds throughout the country, during which people—including those driving—stop whatever they are doing and stand at silent attention in memory of the victims of the Holocaust."
How not to see that this is disgusting, instrumental, obnoxious propaganda? A two minutes siren? You have to stop what you are doing? To be forced to care about events that happened 70 years ago? Reason enough to go live elsewhere, if you ask me.
And this is all happening one day before the birthday of Hitler, how fun is that?
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/isr ... s-1.425268
Whatever makes sense to you...Netanyahu told the crowd gathered at Yad Vashem, "Our enemies tried to bury the Jewish future but our future was born again in the land of our forefathers, here we built a base, and a new beginning of freedom, and hope and action."
Incidentally, there seem to be a lot of "Holocaust remembrance days": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_Remembrance_Day (April 19th is in relation to the Warsaw ghetto uprising: but it also coincides with 27 Nisan, Yom HaShoah, "Holocaust Day" in Israel and everywhere else.)
"On the morning of Yom HaShoah, a two minute siren sounds throughout the country, during which people—including those driving—stop whatever they are doing and stand at silent attention in memory of the victims of the Holocaust."
How not to see that this is disgusting, instrumental, obnoxious propaganda? A two minutes siren? You have to stop what you are doing? To be forced to care about events that happened 70 years ago? Reason enough to go live elsewhere, if you ask me.
And this is all happening one day before the birthday of Hitler, how fun is that?
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Re: The Holocaust: propaganda, censorship and media fakery
An interesting video from youtube:
full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dda-0Q_XUhk
Nothing new, but it shows pretty persuasively how newspapers from 1915 to 1938 were promoting the "six millions" figure linked to exterminations and persecutions of jews across Europe.
Now, as a study on propaganda I think it is interesting to note this: most of the articles if not all of them are aimed at "raising funds". We know from the whole 9/11 experience and similar events that the raising of funds for non existent or hyped victims usually hides embezzlement and these cases, all preceding in time the "holocaust" of jews following WWII, might not be much different.
What's interesting is that the target of these articles seems to be the jewish communities in the USA or Europe much more than the gentile masses everywhere. But why do they insist so much on the six millions figure in such different contexts as Ukraine, Russia, Germany or east europe in general?
We are being told (an I know I will wait in vain some insight on this from the jewish members of this board) that it is the Talmud itself that here or there identifies the number of "six millions" victims, much as the Koran defines the "72 virgins": not "officially" but indirectly and from commentary.
An interesting (although I can't say how correct) reconstruction on how this figure came about can be read here: http://semiticcontroversies.blogspot.it ... igure.html suggesting that the figure might have been a "guzma", an exaggeration that more or less meant "ten times the jews that came out of Egypt".
Whatever the truth, the use of the figure of "six millions" makes a repeated appearance in these articles, and, given the obvious untruthfulness and impossibility of it, combined with the repetition of the number, we seem to be in presence of something that was meant to resound with the hebrew tradition. However, this might not necessarily be because the number has a mystical meaning in itself, rather it is possible that the general assonance to the language and imagery of the hebrew tradition, as in saying "ten times the jews that came out of Egypt", was meant to fool and soften the jewish population itself simply by providing the best language and ultimately the ideal "mood" for the articles: after all those communities were the ones more likely to give.
In other words it is the jews themselves who are being fooled and manipulated here, long before the same method will be used wide and large to manipulate the global population for whom the figure of "6 millions" had no special meaning whatsoever. In terms of understanding how the whole holocaust propaganda came about this is crucial, because the necessity of a new outpost called "israel" smacked in the middle of the arab world had to be sold first of all to the jews. Actually, that's the part of that propaganda that seems to have worked best, since today the denial of a necessary and fatal connection between the accident of being born a jew and the mandatory support to the state of Israel is considered pure blasphemy, or at best stubborn, childish resistance to an inevitable idea. (So much for the idiotic belief, dear to zionists and anti-zionists alike, that jews are more "cunning". I rather think they are fooled just like anybody else and, because of the pride that comes from the prejudice of being somewhat "smarter" by birth, sometimes even more hopelessly).
In any case, I find this tentative explanation more interesting than saying, as I often read on the internet, that the six millions figure was used out of straight belief in the talmudic tradition and to fulfill some scary and all-controlling prophecies and texts. It is possible we might be facing a simple design of consent instead, that used a number instrumentally, because it sounded most convincing in the context of that tradition. Which is how propaganda generally works.
full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dda-0Q_XUhk
Nothing new, but it shows pretty persuasively how newspapers from 1915 to 1938 were promoting the "six millions" figure linked to exterminations and persecutions of jews across Europe.
Now, as a study on propaganda I think it is interesting to note this: most of the articles if not all of them are aimed at "raising funds". We know from the whole 9/11 experience and similar events that the raising of funds for non existent or hyped victims usually hides embezzlement and these cases, all preceding in time the "holocaust" of jews following WWII, might not be much different.
What's interesting is that the target of these articles seems to be the jewish communities in the USA or Europe much more than the gentile masses everywhere. But why do they insist so much on the six millions figure in such different contexts as Ukraine, Russia, Germany or east europe in general?
We are being told (an I know I will wait in vain some insight on this from the jewish members of this board) that it is the Talmud itself that here or there identifies the number of "six millions" victims, much as the Koran defines the "72 virgins": not "officially" but indirectly and from commentary.
An interesting (although I can't say how correct) reconstruction on how this figure came about can be read here: http://semiticcontroversies.blogspot.it ... igure.html suggesting that the figure might have been a "guzma", an exaggeration that more or less meant "ten times the jews that came out of Egypt".
Whatever the truth, the use of the figure of "six millions" makes a repeated appearance in these articles, and, given the obvious untruthfulness and impossibility of it, combined with the repetition of the number, we seem to be in presence of something that was meant to resound with the hebrew tradition. However, this might not necessarily be because the number has a mystical meaning in itself, rather it is possible that the general assonance to the language and imagery of the hebrew tradition, as in saying "ten times the jews that came out of Egypt", was meant to fool and soften the jewish population itself simply by providing the best language and ultimately the ideal "mood" for the articles: after all those communities were the ones more likely to give.
In other words it is the jews themselves who are being fooled and manipulated here, long before the same method will be used wide and large to manipulate the global population for whom the figure of "6 millions" had no special meaning whatsoever. In terms of understanding how the whole holocaust propaganda came about this is crucial, because the necessity of a new outpost called "israel" smacked in the middle of the arab world had to be sold first of all to the jews. Actually, that's the part of that propaganda that seems to have worked best, since today the denial of a necessary and fatal connection between the accident of being born a jew and the mandatory support to the state of Israel is considered pure blasphemy, or at best stubborn, childish resistance to an inevitable idea. (So much for the idiotic belief, dear to zionists and anti-zionists alike, that jews are more "cunning". I rather think they are fooled just like anybody else and, because of the pride that comes from the prejudice of being somewhat "smarter" by birth, sometimes even more hopelessly).
In any case, I find this tentative explanation more interesting than saying, as I often read on the internet, that the six millions figure was used out of straight belief in the talmudic tradition and to fulfill some scary and all-controlling prophecies and texts. It is possible we might be facing a simple design of consent instead, that used a number instrumentally, because it sounded most convincing in the context of that tradition. Which is how propaganda generally works.
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Re: The Holocaust: propaganda, censorship and media fakery
Not to imply that funds weren't generated and appropriated in the 9/11 shenanigans (and quite likely in this historic instance as well) but aren't there easier ways to make a lot more money? Assuming the level of power and control implied? If you could pull off con games on this scale, I doubt you'd have any trouble at all coming up with billions from much simpler and more discreet cons.nonhocapito wrote:Now, as a study on propaganda I think it is interesting to note this: most of the articles if not all of them are aimed at "raising funds". We know from the whole 9/11 experience and similar events that the raising of funds for non existent or hyped victims usually hides embezzlement and these cases, all preceding in time the "holocaust" of jews following WWII, might not be much different.
It's there but I think the money itself isn't the point. Maybe it's to make the story more real, or maybe it's to quite literally invest the audience in the story in the same way as audience members in a more mundane act can be invited up to the stage - to make them participate in the story or act itself, so they come to identify with it and feel a part of it. Who knows, but I'm having difficulty picturing money as the point. It's only speculation of course but my thought would be that it's an element of the act more than a motive.
Think of the blood donation drives from 9/11 for another example. It all got tossed, blood banks were trying to tell people to stop. In vain, because the media and political machine outshouted them and urged people to keep giving. The point obviously wasn't to collect blood in such vast amounts, since the vast majority was simply poured down the drain, but to generate some sort of effect that invests the audience in the act.
Re: The Holocaust: propaganda, censorship and media fakery
Holy smoke! Adolf Hitler = Dollar Thief
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Re: The Holocaust: propaganda, censorship and media fakery
ha ha, good one, Brian. How about Torah filled?brianv wrote:Holy smoke! Adolf Hitler = Dollar Thief