Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Simon Shack's (Tycho Brahe-inspired) geoaxial binary system. Discuss the book and website for the most accurate configuration of our solar system ever devised - which soundly puts to rest the geometrically impossible Copernican-Keplerian model.

Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby hoi.polloi on March 18th, 2018, 5:55 pm

Excuse my enthusiasm and joy in being honored as the co-editor (with kham) of one of the most important books of our generation. "But," you may ask, "Even if this book is so wonderful why does a science book belong at CluesForum.info where we primarily discuss media fakery?"

Well, let me put it this way, in a simple numbered list of reasons the TYCHOS discussion not only belongs here but is extremely appropriate to the topic of media fakery itself. It is a matter of opinion, I understand. I am open to being incredibly wrong about this. Nonetheless, please consider:

1. Simon Shack is the preeminent researcher in media fakery and propaganda, having proven to be a reliable, real, down-to-Earth person that has a humble and genuine interest in the truth. He has maintained decorum and constant output while others have resorted to charging for similar free public information that should be considered critical to public knowledge, to insulting Simon and throwing suspicion at him just because they don't understand the information or they are not in the research for the right reasons, or to producing a lot of talk but no original research. All of his unpaid work has nonetheless received no media attention whatsoever and "the silence is deafening" as it increasingly becomes clear that the main suspicions of September Clues have not only proven true but also serve as timeless understandings of how criminal minds have worked against "the average Jane/Joe" (of all races across the world) for centuries. Ergo, just about anything Simon puts his mind to regarding related topics may best be posted in broad public daylight at every opportunity, as it may benefit humanity at large, and benefit Simon (to receive feedback and better "tune" his sharp mind that we have all benefited from).

2. The topic of the cosmos — including the solar system, space, the stars and planets and our own temporary Earthly home that we steward — is one that criminal minds (we are learning about) involved in faking history and current events have been working to control and dominate since Religion became a non-local tool used to subvert, convert and colonize foreign people. Synonymous with the cosmos has been the discussion of deities and the nature of reality and the meaning of our lives. There is ample evidence that an underlying insecurity the aggressors wish to instill in their "servile" peoples is a void of inner and outer knowing. So-called royal families, churches, temples and cults of all kinds have tried to criminalize different ways of knowing inborn peace and largely succeeded. With a string of hot and cold wars, massacres, crusades and jihads and whatever the hell the Jewish equivalent of such are, torture, execution, brainwashing, social shame and all justified under some "divine might makes right". We will not overturn "might makes right" or the way power functions but for an "average Joe" like Simon to overturn those justifications is a win for all people under oppression by imperial or colonial culture with the arrogance to tell the average person they deserve dehumanizing treatment just for thinking outside violently standardized modalities.

3. Simon's forum was originally created as a way of spreading the word about a shocking variety of hoaxes from throughout recorded and remembered time. As September Clues was a "key" (as tired as that trope may be) for many to awakening to elaborate hoaxes and psychopathic performances in general, but which grew the subject well beyond a single (relatively minor) propaganda campaign to the number of concurrently operated lies (or misdirections away from our own sense of power and control over our lives), CluesForum became subsequently about NASA hoaxes, War-time hoaxes, questionable "assassinations" and a variety of other topics — gradually expanding to newly accepted understandings that science itself has been a highly corrupted practice always bent to the results the dominators want, even if it isn't as effective as they would like. Discussing a model that has "un-bent" the egotistical leanings of the vastly powerful Catholic Church (and other infiltrators and distorters) is a bright signal to all and any in a position of knowing that they too can come forward against pressure to suppress observation and interpretation. That, after all, is the underlying purpose of questioning together as we have done on all topics. The subject of the geometry of our system is just one more topic where so-called enlightened people have been (both unwittingly and "wittingly") led to dead ends by criminal forces. It is high time such wastes of our time and attention were retired right along with the Steven Hawking mythology.

4. Finally, please consider that while other science topics are largely speculative, Simon's topic is actually a functional theory for the solar system and — like the best and most interesting science — raises more questions about how our world works and allows us to question and probe further into the cosmic mystery of life without encountering several previous dead-ends that often even seem to have been set up (or promoted) deliberately to discourage the human spirit from free inquiry. Some of those "dead ends" include Black Holes and Dark Matter (the end of matter), the Big Bang (the end of the beginning), the Big Crunch or Cosmic Cooling (the end of the end) and other topics which, while on the surface seem to raise more questions, in fact leave the questioning firmly in the hands of an academic self-proclaimed elite who would dismiss subtler sciences for an infinite materialism that shrinks human spirit, makes us needlessly fear death (or even worship it) even more than we already have a tendency to and generally make us feel that we are worthless and we need cruel masters. CluesForum is a "cyber place" (even if slightly nomadic by necessity) that has always maintained the right to question and doubt everything these cruel masters have to say as a means of regaining confidence that nobody deserves such treatment. As such, the best place to challenge Simon's theory will also be here at a fairly well-maintained forum that respects the right to question and doubt when done in an intelligent, cogent and (ideally) culturally sensitive and universal manner in good humor. The TYCHOS also functions very well as a counterpoint to those who would say there is no need to move on from NASA's bogus and absurd children's stories of space, time and history.

I could come up with other general reasons, such as simply "Hey, it's Simon's forum. Duh. Makes sense." or "It's annoying to set up and maintain yet another forum in yet another place." and those reasons may not make sense for very long. But now I've said my piece about this and I hope you will all be happy to have the discussion here (or at least not bothered by others having the discussion "nearby" to the fakery discussions).

Yours,
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby nonhocapito on March 21st, 2018, 11:17 pm

Here's for my disappointing reply.

I have no objections to this forum being one of those platforms to discuss such important research, but this is mostly because I have lost most of my hopes for this forum. They died under the countless hyper-active threads on anything scientific, a long ago. Under different circumstances I would probably bother to tell you that none of your arguments are really convincing, Hoi, and that this forum should be protected from any discussion over topics such as the science of the cosmos, that are only remotely linked to the research on media fakery through the accidental presence of NASA (and we know that the relationship of NASA with space is accidental, since all its activities happen down here on earth) and that have been historically systematically used to stifle much more proficient discussions of the political reality of the moment. (And to think it takes literally ten clicks to create a new forum and giving it a dark blue theme and calling it scienceclues. A few more clicks, not many, to move all the scientific threads from here to there. To think it would have made so much sense if you had done so years ago, so that you would have today a thriving community of people freely discussing scientific discoveries without having to commit to any other idea on history, politics or propaganda. What an amazing readership would that forum make today for Simon's upcoming book.)

I also think that it's all to be proven that there lies a conspiracy of the elites behind the current theories of the solar system. I am more keen to believe that these theories are there because they served to explain reality to the extent we needed to explain it, and if there are more useful explanations coming to light, those will be welcome as well. You may notice that I speak of utility, and not of truth, since what we may have room to eventually learn is that history and science have been flexed to obey to their many masters essentially because their real nature is the pursue of utility, and not of truth. The interesting discovery is that nobody is above this! including Simon whose noble pursue of truth you refer to is still linked to utility, as you yourself describe it, chiefly the political/social utility of ridding the world of the burden of the parasitic elite that wants to rule over us. Notice that I'm not saying any of this to diminish in any way Simon's efforts or anybody else's on this forum or elsewhere, but only to diminish the value of your arguments as they seem to appeal to this pursue of truth to confer some sort of moral authority, which somehow should be reflected in better research and better science? when in fact the practical utility of such pursue is a much more interesting way to judge someone's work. Kurosawa's Rashomon and all that, I guess.

Emancipating people from the burden of media and propaganda, I love that. I immediately see the immense political, social, moral and emotional repercussions of that. Pursuing the truth on the nature of the Solar system, I don't feel so invested in it. It doesn't seem urgent at all, to be honest. I appreciate scientific progress, of course, and all the brilliant inventions and solutions it can bring down the line, but the discovery itself is in a completely different realm, far from to the overturning of media fakery and propaganda. It belong more to the category of personal achievement, community achievement, which is what you are trying to sell here. I wish the utility of this was so clear that it would pop out even through your elaborate language, but it isn't so. That's where the magic word "truth" you like so much loses most of its glory, for me.

I look forward to people being treated with good humor and respect when coming here to discuss Simon's findings. It would be kind of interesting, however, to know who out there in the world in your opinion is going to be entitled to judge the scientific correctness of this book with some authority. Maybe this has already been stated in some other thread, either that there are no authorities left to judge anything, or that some have been identified whose judgment will be, if not accepted, respected and considered. Sportsmanship would ideally require you to announce which ones they are, in advance.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby antipodean on March 22nd, 2018, 1:45 am

nonhocapito » March 22nd, 2018, 10:17 am wrote:Emancipating people from the burden of media and propaganda, I love that. I immediately see the immense political, social, moral and emotional repercussions of that. Pursuing the truth on the nature of the Solar system, I don't feel so invested in it.


I pretty much agree although speaking as someone who hasn't really been interested in exploring the nature of our Solar System, Simon's research has piqued some interest in me when looking at the numbers.

Does our earth really travel nearly a billion Ks a year when circumnavigating the Sun ? 150 mil Ks X 6.28 = 942mil

Also @ 1mph or 1.6kph the Earth would take 67,392 years to circumnavigate the Sun. The TYCHOS model has the Earth taking 25,344 years to circumnavigate the Sun.

So is the TYCHOS model saying that the Earth is 56 million Ks from the Sun ?
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby hoi.polloi on March 22nd, 2018, 4:57 am

I appreciate your perspective nonhocapito. For you it's perhaps easy to set up and run another forum and separate the topic from fakery or tie them together with related topics rather than have them on the same forum. For me, it doesn't seem so simple yet. My mind naturally is curious about the nature of the world and sees the connections directly: "fake" suggests "real" and debate about fake and real naturally brings up the same science topics over and over. The topic often becomes: what is reality?

Of course, you are right that most of the time a style of refutation (or deduction) is wonderful enough. "This cannot happen" is good enough for much of the news but some media is more sophisticated than that; it involves lies about larger topics. Simon's new model is actually an excellent example of a comfortable place you can come to after you have realized all that cannot happen in a media realm of fiction (that they say is happening anyway, even though it's unphysical) and find that what remains is the truth just "jumping out" at you. I think that's what Simon experienced as he tore down the contradictions of the Copernican system. It's a journey he is graciously inviting everyone to experience for themselves.

But you have to take the first step and be brave enough to ask these questions.

To make very good arguments, we often use a balanced approach of deduction and induction combined. Inductive reasoning is about finding patterns and extrapolating theory from it, if I'm not mistaken. You may say I am using that word incorrectly but hopefully my point is made. Okay, this is not your favorite approach. Deduction is very attractive too, but I think we should give heavily scrutinized theories a chance when they are set up to both stand on their own and combat the stupid set ups made by gangsters.

Maybe you would observe that the TYCHOS has not been scrutinized well and that doesn't sound like a task you are interested in. Very well. Then, let it just exist in this "side" place while the majority of the forum is dedicated to other topics.

When we "found out" that crashing airplanes cannot actually do what they were depicted doing on television (and yes, it did take "figuring out" for many people as they did not have enough understanding of physics and science to appreciate the impossibility and the unphysicality of the simulation) it was helpful in confirming the fake images.

nonhocapito wrote:Sportsmanship would ideally require you to announce which ones they are, in advance.


Simon's the best at determining this, but I never heard him say, "[person] is not qualified to judge my model!"

Instead, I think he is just asking people to look at it and consider it. If you are not willing to do that, fair enough. Let others.

antipodean wrote:The TYCHOS model has the Earth taking 25,344 years to circumnavigate the Sun.


I will leave this for other topics in our new TYCHOS forum, since this is about the question of TYCHOS's place here at CluesForum, but please do bring up your questions in the new TYCHOS thread "Introducing the TYCHOS" or start your own! Would you like an answer to this question? (For starters, the Earth does not circumnavigate the Sun in the TYCHOS model. But I invite you to read the Summary, Preface and Foreword to begin. I will copy your question to that topic as an invitation for you to look at the topic just a little more. The water's fine!)
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby hoi.polloi on March 22nd, 2018, 5:53 pm

From the other discussion:

nonhocapito wrote: Furthermore, the research on media fakery itself has gone nowhere since the scientific discussion took over around here. You can call this opinion pessimistic or polemic but it cannot possibly surprise you coming from me.


Look, perhaps nobody laments more than me the fact that there isn't enough original research being done on media fakery here. We set up this forum for everyone to post about it all and a number of factors all resulted in very very few people (even those that support our research) willing to contribute their own solid analysis. Too many here (many just johnny-come-lately's not really demonstrating understanding of the specific capabilities of CGI and Hollywood fakery), and certainly too many on Fakeologist and other places, seem content to point out "weird numbers" and generally fail to train themselves on actual technology, shrug and if anything point out confirmation bias about their favorite conspiracy being true instead of practicing forensics.

We know this already. Even after practically begging our readership to just try learning the basics of video editing, for many TV is still just "magic" that you either choose to believe (and this somehow causes the illusions to become real) or choose not to believe (but it's still real for most). We know that that is how many people are. They cannot understand the consensus reality around Disney illusion technology or the "dead giveaways" like seams, strings, chroma-keying, compositing and other basics of photo manipulation. We know we are lacking when a user joins to post the latest YouTube video and exclaim, "What do you think?!" instead of explaining what the video shows, explain what's not just "funny" about the story but what's wrong with the story.

I wouldn't chalk it up to our science threads. Indeed this forum may just be even more lifeless if our science arguments/discussions disappeared from here altogether. Who is to say? You really think it's a "competition" for attention? I am not so sure.

However, we still do get a small very valuable trickle of comments that are fresh analysis you don't find anywhere else. And that is still why I value the place. And I think we should be so grateful for even the small amount we do have. After all, we've compiled a huge resource for people to learn about questions about probably close to a hundred PsyOps.

For me it's a bonus that the science discussions happen here and personally I think it helps discussions of fakery because it reminds people there is a reality (as difficult to understand as it is) and not some fluid cross-dimensional lie that becomes real due to black magic. Ideally, maybe, there needs to be a new focused forum set up, but I'm not sure how much it would be valued, even by myself. I mostly like the combination of topics here at CluesForum. I think other forums handle other venn diagrams of subject matter more appropriately to those cyber locations.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby nonhocapito on March 28th, 2018, 2:13 pm

You are right, Hoi. There is still reason to be grateful for this forum. Is there any other place like this anyhow? And Simon's model IS damn interesting. But I still stand by the fact that a new forum to host the discussion on the Tychos would be much better. Disconnected from fakery, it could attract all sorts of people who, once and if enabled to learn and respect Simon's research, could take that extra step towards the investigation of fakery on their own volition, later on (and if not, why should they be on here anyhow?)
You see the alternative is asking them indirectly to basically take the whole package, everything that it is here, as something they now have to deal with. Not sure that's the best approach for that newcomer, teenager or pensioner or anything in between, who probably is passionate about looking up to the sky in clear aversion from the material ugliness of whatever is down here on earth.
Also an effort to remove THIS forum from all the scientific discussion could make the research on media fakery much more poignant, focused and readable here. But I've said this so many times I do realize the words are starting to lose their meaning.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby simonshack on March 28th, 2018, 9:23 pm

Dear Nonho,

I do value your views & opinions and understand them. Short of creating yet another website / forum though (which would really stretch my and Hoi's overall resources), I guess we could just set up a "Discussion" area at Tychos.info. For now however (i.e. the coming weeks), I will make a few posts here to clarify my Tychos model for our members & readers. This is, after all, a go-to-place for the most thoughtful, open-minded folks of this world - is it not?
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby patrix on March 29th, 2018, 5:35 pm

I fail to see the problem/issue here. Interested in Tychos? Click, read discuss. Not interested? Don't click. Go to media fakery threads instead.

I'll be the first to admit that I found Simon's model outlandish when I first laid eyes on it. How could the Heliocentric model be wrong!? But knowing he was right about 9/11, Terrorist Attacks, Space travel, and the hardest one for me - Satellites and rockets, I felt I had to give it a good look.

And it is a hard and abstract subject, but now when I understand it I also see how every piece of data refutes the Copernican model and supports Tychos. And it's public data. Take star parallaxes for example. They are the only evidence that the Earth moves at all in relation to the firmament. And she does, just not that much :-) But what the data also shows and that's interesting, is that we have about an equal amount of positive and negative parallax, which in turn invalidates the Copernican model.

So which way does the Copernicans want to take it? Either you discard the only proof you have that the Earth moves at all or you admit it cannot move the way you claim.

And it breaks my heart to read how veterans on the forum like Brian leaves in outspoken protest. I think Simon deserves better than that.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby nonhocapito on March 30th, 2018, 6:36 am

patrix » Yesterday, 21:35 wrote:I fail to see the problem/issue here. Interested in Tychos? Click, read discuss. Not interested? Don't click. Go to media fakery threads instead.


1) there's the other angle too, whether people who are interested in astronomy should discuss Tychos on a media fakery forum, and would that be good for Tychos.

2) there is a history of how discussions over scientific matters among amateurs (without implying any disrespect) and probably among "professionals" as well, tend to turn into bottomless vortexes that suck energy out of people, yet achieving very little in term of immediate emancipation and growth in the mentality of people or their stand in society.
Otherwise why do you figure have we witnessed this epochal move away from religion and into popular science in the last two centuries? After all religion was good enough to manipulate people... It turns out science is even better, seeing that the majority of us hasn't developed out of this transformation any extra ability to discern reality from magic tricks, but rather we get crushed by all the complex/confusing/contradicting scientific ideas constantly thrown at us.
There are countless examples of this and this forum isn't an exception.
Now, Simon's research is obviously not disinfo or distraction (I don't think that for one minute), but there is still a case to be made that the research on media fakery and the little energies dedicated to it only stand to suffer from this.

Anyway, I like Simon's stance for now, sort of a temporarily beta run of the model on here where open-minded people are, before it makes it big through some other channel, and ideally grows a space of its own.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby patrix on March 30th, 2018, 7:37 am

there's the other angle too, whether people who are interested in astronomy should discuss Tychos on a media fakery forum, and would that be good for Tychos.

I don't see a problem and the media fakery and science fakery/delusions are intertwined. Before a person understands the space hoax, they may be unable to even consider Simons model. It was so in my case at least.

there is a history of how discussions over scientific matters among amateurs (without implying any disrespect) and probably among "professionals" as well, tend to turn into bottomless vortexes

Without being disrespectful myself, and I do hold a master's, I think the problem lies more with the academics themselves. The snobbery, groupthink and "educated ignorance" have reached unprecedented levels. I would say they/me are welcome in the discussion if they step down from their horses and take a look at the actual reality instead of swimming among themselves in a sea of unconfirmed mathematical formulas and contrived language. Look at this model made by a musician in Rome for example. In my view the most significant intellectual achievement ever.
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby Kham on March 30th, 2018, 7:34 pm

Non-Fakery

As a high school teacher, I have experienced that one of the best ways for students to comprehend certain subjects is to not only see examples of that topic but to also look at non-examples. We have many examples of fakery posted here at Clues Forum but not so much of the non-example.

A good example and non-example side by side really illuminates the subject at hand. I look forward to many non-examples of fakery being posted here at Clues Forum, and I don’t mean posts which contain specifically prepared videos and wording from disinformation specialists which contain obvious and tiresome strawman arguments. Instead of the clutter of esoteric one time nonrepeatable experiments, a well prepared non-example of fakery contains good science which is understandable, repeatable and predictable.

So pleased to see one of the most important examples of non-fakery of our time, TYCHOS, posted here at Clues Forum. Let the comparing begin so the world can see what real science should look like. Exciting times!
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Re: Why CluesForum.info for discussions of the TYCHOS model?

Postby hoi.polloi on April 15th, 2018, 6:20 pm

For user satisfaction I have added a micro forum to Tychos.info.

I hope that nonhocapito and others will feel happy about using it! B)
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