Truth Movement

How the controlled opposition was designed to be part of the 9/11 hoax

Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby JamieK on Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:25 pm

Thanks for your replies.

I always thought there was something odd about the Truth Movement from the very beginning even though I got sucked into it. How did they know what they claimed to know? Why were they so organized? Why were they called the Truth Movement which sounded a lot like the Ministry of Truth in George Orwell's book 1984?

Makes perfect sense now that I think about it.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby Makkonen on Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:34 pm

JamieK wrote:I always thought there was something odd about the Truth Movement from the very beginning even though I got sucked into it. How did they know what they claimed to know? Why were they so organized? Why were they called the Truth Movement which sounded a lot like the Ministry of Truth in George Orwell's book 1984?

Makes perfect sense now that I think about it.


Exactly.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby simonshack on Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:02 pm

*


THE (PHONY) SEPTEMBER CLUES HUGGERS
Richard Hall - Phil Jayhan - Judy Wood & co


ImageImageImage


The so-called "9/11 truth movement" was set up ever since day one to control whoever would have come close to revealing the real truth of 9/11 or, in other words, exposing the central role of the news media corporations in enacting the wretched hoax. I believe the release of September Clues triggered the 9/11 truth gatekeepers' "Plan Z" - the directives/instructions of which might have been worded a bit like this:

"Infiltrate, cajole and befriend the investigators who expose the news media involvement, concoct and promulgate a number of seemingly supportive, borderline yet ultimately off-putting and eccentric theories - in order to instill confusion and despondency in the minds of people who approach and assess the crux of the 9/11 psyop - as exposed by those who put their finger on it."


I ask the reader to forgive me (as the maker of September Clues) for the apparent yet unavoidable 'presumptuousness' of my present 'diatribe'. I try (as much as possible) to avoid commenting on the various, obvious trolls/infiltrators enrolled to contaminate the wider September Clues findings. However, I feel that the time has come for me to denounce - or at least show my awareness - of the multitude of insidious maneuvers aimed at derailing our (now common) research into la-la-land.

We have hosted such infiltrators on this very forum and they have been, one by one, been undressed and duly booted from here. Yet others are working 'behind the scenes' and, more smartly, act as if Cluesforum doesn't exist. I have chosen 3 such clowns to illustrate this point:

-Richard Hall
-Judy Wood
-Phil Jayhan

Richard Hall (of "RichPlanet.net") released in 2010 a video/docu of sorts, seemingly supportive of September Clues. (Richard Hall evidently deals with idiotic and kooky UFO matters and claims to have been working on the UK Trident Nuclear Program - and so on and so forth.) Here is a section of his docu, which features an interview with Phil Jayhan - the founder of the Let'sRoll forums:

Listen to Phil Jayhan, at 1:06 - as he firmly states :
"It definitely has nothing to do with Photoshop"



full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3WiMZfWKwE

This other Richard Hall interview features Judy Wood. It's an unbearably long thing (1h17min)- just posting it for the record:

full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udDkMP4MF6A

At 3:28 into the above video, we have this most bizarre banner appearing :
Image

Old Jews Telling Jokes. Must be painfully hilarious... Cover your ears! <_<

**************************************************************************************************************************************************

Of course, Phil Jayhan (who has constantly combated/dismissed the CGI evidence) now champions the Vicsim evidence. He started doing so soon after Hoi Polloi released his groundbreaking Vicsim Report. Why, you might ask, did Jayhan do so? It is all part of the gatekeeping tactics: the gatekeepers MUST appear to be on TOP of the research, lest they slip into total irrelevance. Meanwhile, Phil Jayhan has decided to ban ALL links to September Clues on his forum...( I am not saying all the LetsRoll forum members are criminal/corrupt gatekeepers - only Phil Jayhan is - and has always been.)
Image
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby upstream on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:16 pm

We have hosted such infiltrators on this very forum and they have been, one by one, been undressed and duly booted from here.


Why do you say this in the past tense? The presence of "sophisticated" infiltration (ex. D.Duck, fred, ozzybinoswald etc.) is still very much a pernicious issue.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby simonshack on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:24 pm

upstream wrote:
We have hosted such infiltrators on this very forum and they have been, one by one, been undressed and duly booted from here.


Why do you say this in the past tense? The presence of "sophisticated" infiltration (ex. D.Duck, fred, ozzybinoswald etc.) is still very much a pernicious issue.



:huh: :blink: They are not here anymore. They have been dealt with. What's your point?

Besides, I am sure there are (and will be) many more such infiltrators on this forum. I have no illusion that Cluesforum will ever be troll-free. It is up to every single member to use his/hers cognitive abilities to smell out the trolls. Please help me out - I do not claim to have 'super-powers' to detect all of these invasive/pernicious entities.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby upstream on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:35 pm

simonshack wrote:
upstream wrote:
We have hosted such infiltrators on this very forum and they have been, one by one, been undressed and duly booted from here.


Why do you say this in the past tense? The presence of "sophisticated" infiltration (ex. D.Duck, fred, ozzybinoswald etc.) is still very much a pernicious issue.



:huh: :blink: They are not here anymore. They have been dealt with. What's your point?

Besides, I am sure there are (and will be) many more such infiltrators on this forum. I have no illusion that this forum will ever be troll-free.


What does "dealt with" mean? Banning them? If so, what stops them (and others like them) from registering under a new name? Did those members happen to visit the site behind a proxy?
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby simonshack on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:37 pm

upstream wrote:
What does "dealt with" mean? Banning them? If so, what stops them (and others like them) from registering under a new name? Did those members happen to visit the site behind a proxy?


No. Nothing stops them from doing so. Again, may I ask you if you have a simple solution for this problem?
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby upstream on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:43 pm

simonshack wrote:
upstream wrote:
What does "dealt with" mean? Banning them? If so, what stops them (and others like them) from registering under a new name? Did those members happen to visit the site behind a proxy?


No. Nothing stops them from doing so. Again, may I ask you if you have a simple solution for this problem?


Well, I don't have a simple solution, but here's something that I think is fair that we can start with...

Please list the members of this forum (prominent/frequent/noteworthy posters) who hide behind a proxy.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby brianv on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:49 pm

upstream wrote:
simonshack wrote:
upstream wrote:
What does "dealt with" mean? Banning them? If so, what stops them (and others like them) from registering under a new name? Did those members happen to visit the site behind a proxy?


No. Nothing stops them from doing so. Again, may I ask you if you have a simple solution for this problem?


Well, I don't have a simple solution, but here's something that I think is fair that we can start with...

Please list the members of this forum (prominent/frequent/noteworthy posters) who hide behind a proxy.


Who is "we"?
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby simonshack on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:49 pm

upstream wrote:
Please list the members of this forum (prominent/frequent/noteworthy posters) who hide behind a proxy.

Dear Upstream,

May I start by publishing the IP data that refers to you?
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby upstream on Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:05 pm

simonshack wrote:Dear Upstream,

May I start by publishing the IP data that refers to you?




No. I would not appreciate that. I never asked you to start listing IP addresses. Why do you say this? I'm asking you to list who hides behind a proxy. Not list IP addresses. I do not hide behind a proxy.

Here's a post from Clues Forum Administrator Nonhocapito (whose posts I greatly respect):
1) I would be very uncomfortable if everyone on this forum used a proxy. The idea that proxies protect you from agencies set out to, let's say, "monitor the opposition" or similar activity, DOES NOT STAND, because such agencies have very likely the means to go to the source and circumvent the proxy. Maybe they OWN the proxy server, how about that?
If anything, as I said, the use of the proxy makes them even more curious about the person behind it.
On the other hand: proxies do harm the admins, and the openness of a forum, because you cannot ever be sure if one user is also being another user and another and another, and makes you wonder even more how much acting and pretending is going on throughout. Catch my drift? Bottom line, if everyone used a proxy we should seriously think about banning proxies...

http://www.cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=144&start=45



*
Why, do you think, you should use a proxy to access a forum like this one? What do you think can happen here? We are researchers and commentators, we are not criminals or conspirators. We provide a service, if anything, and some of us have provided much more (I'd say a contribute to History, and I'm not even exaggerating.)
But really, what is the point to hide behind a proxy? Nothing illegal goes on. Besides, suppose you have people monitoring these threads looking for who-knows-what. Wouldn't a proxy make them even more curious about who you are?
Also: suppose you are one of the bad guys and you want to lure all the people that are "suspicious", all those that have "something to hide", or "forbidden ideas" to expose: what would you do? You create a "safe" network where people can "hide", so that now you have a list of relevant names served to you on a silver plate!
I remember Alex Jones years ago advising everyone to "use an anonymization service". That should ring some bell, no? I think it is a Maoist-Fascist-something dictatorship strategy to apparently allow for some "secret" way for criticism, only to gather names of people to put in jails later! Granted we are not even there, we are not under Mao. Regardless, I think we can exercise our right to speech with some style... let the bad guys and their "hackers" play with "secrets"...

http://www.cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=144&start=30#p2350972

it was just to say that i have seen one or two users using a proxy. And I always wondered, honestly, why was that? But I am not here to say that it is wrong on principle, just wondering what benefit one thinks to have from using a proxy, beside being able to connect multiple times with different identities.

http://www.cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=144&start=45#p2351009

*Edited to add more quote from Nonhocapito.
Last edited by upstream on Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby anon1911 on Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:23 pm

upstream wrote:Here's a post from Clues Forum Administrator Nonhocapito (whose posts I greatly respect):
1) I would be very uncomfortable if everyone on this forum used a proxy. The idea that proxies protect you from agencies set out to, let's say, "monitor the opposition" or similar activity, DOES NOT STAND, because such agencies have very likely the means to go to the source and circumvent the proxy. Maybe they OWN the proxy server, how about that?
If anything, as I said, the use of the proxy makes them even more curious about the person behind it.
On the other hand: proxies do harm the admins, and the openness of a forum, because you cannot ever be sure if one user is also being another user and another and another, and makes you wonder even more how much acting and pretending is going on throughout. Catch my drift? Bottom line, if everyone used a proxy we should seriously think about banning proxies...

http://www.cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=144&start=45



I find Nonhocapitos statement kinda weird, since I find it wrong in so many aspects.

How about hosting your own proxyserver? No agency would be able to "own" it then. Furthermore you can't identify who's behind a proxy.
Therefore agencies are not more interested in people behind a proxy because they can't even know you're behind a proxy.

Proxies do harm the admins? In what way? I bet 99% of the forum user have a dynamic IP, so how can you be sure that a user is the "real" user?

Banning proxies? HOW?! By IP-banning a million IP addresses?

Beside proxies there are a hundred other ways to hide ones privacy. VPNs, the I2P network, Tor etc.
You can't ban anyone.


By the way, Simon, how come you are so sure about the fact that the Truth Movement has been build up to spread desinformation? Is this speculation only or are there any 'hard' facts?
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby upstream on Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:05 am

Did those members happen to visit the site behind a proxy?


Simon, I never got a clear answer to this.
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby simonshack on Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:18 am

anon1911 wrote:By the way, Simon, how come you are so sure about the fact that the Truth Movement has been build up to spread desinformation? Is this speculation only or are there any 'hard' facts?


Anon,

You may use the search function of this forum to look up the 'hard facts' concerning:


INCOMPLETE LIST OF 9/11 GATEKEEPERS


- Nico Haupt
- Rosalee Grable (aka the Webfairy)
- Richard Gage
- Phil Jayhan
- Judy Wood
- Ace Baker
- Morgan Reynolds
- Richard Hall
- Jim Fetzer
- Kevin Barrett
- Alex Jones
- Luke Rudowski
- Dylan Avery
- Jason Bermas
- David Ray Griffin
- David Shayler
- Willy Rodriguez
- Rick Siegel
- etc...etc...

Just put their names through the search function of this forum. Enjoy!
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Re: Truth Movement

Unread postby nonhocapito on Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:27 am

anon1911 wrote:I find Nonhocapitos statement kinda weird, since I find it wrong in so many aspects.

How about hosting your own proxyserver? No agency would be able to "own" it then. Furthermore you can't identify who's behind a proxy.
Therefore agencies are not more interested in people behind a proxy because they can't even know you're behind a proxy.

Proxies do harm the admins? In what way? I bet 99% of the forum user have a dynamic IP, so how can you be sure that a user is the "real" user?

Banning proxies? HOW?! By IP-banning a million IP addresses?

Beside proxies there are a hundred other ways to hide ones privacy. VPNs, the I2P network, Tor etc.
You can't ban anyone.


Well, of course proxies and TOR or similar tools are a neat idea if you have to circumvent censorship or hide your identity for some purpose. However, I still have to understand why, for what unfathomable reason, one should hide one's identity behind a proxy on this forum.
(For the same lack of reason it is equally fantastic to think about having our own proxy server. Who needs it?)

Of course dynamic IPs, and in general the "anonymity" of the internet are already a sort of "cover" for all of us. Our names are not explicitly readable next to our posts (unless we want it) which, on a certain level and for some of us, can be useful so that we are not inhibited in expressing opinions that are socially unrewarding or unacceptable (this becomes obvious if, for example, from 9/11 we move the discussion to a topic like, say, the holocaust).

I think that dynamic ips and a nickname are more than enough for all of us as a level of anonymity. Personally i have no problem giving my real name after a few chats on skype or via email, but I have a lot of hook-ups about using my name on the internet where it ends, forever, in google. As long as I post things that are meant for the internet, i hold on to my nickname. Someone, like Simon, is comfortable doing even without this caution and I cannot but commend the principle.
In any case we can all be sure that if certain agents and agencies want to learn who we are, they can. Even if we are behind "7 proxies". I have no doubts about that. To me a nickname is more meant for the world at large than as a naive protection against the "establishment".

Lastly, about "banning proxies" -- certainly it would be impossible to do it systematically. But there are lists of proxies out there and one could, theoretically, keep a list updated and check ip numbers against it -- in general stating that using a proxy is not admitted. Luckily there seem to be little need to do this at this stage.
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