Engineering disease

Historical insights & thoughts about the world we live in - and the social conditioning exerted upon us by past and current propaganda.

Re: Engineering disease

Postby patrix on Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:51 am

>BTW, thank you Kham for helping me see: fruit is not the enemy, because fruit is fructose not glucose.

Oh dear. I just have to say something here.

Fructose is worse than glucose in the respect that it’s harder for the body to metabolize. That doesn’t mean you cannot eat a little fruit (at least if you're not a diabteic or insulin resistant), but it’s sure isn’t something that’s better than ordinary sugar. And juice is worse than fruit, because the fiber helps slow down the sugar uptake.
This video is educational on this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

It’s an enigma to me that many in these circles are so ill informed in this area and promoting things as self evident truths that are simply wrong or heavily disputed. And to point that out is soo touchy and controversial. This subject has to be so moderated as not to hurt any feelings. And the scary thing here is that we now have doctors that have been brainwashed with the Nutwork medicine and an alternative health movement that’s been brainwashed with vegetarian/vegan propaganda. Oh dear.
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Re: Engineering 'disease'

Postby Observer on Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:25 am

Observer wrote:Actually fruit is healthy since raw fruit sugar is 'good, simple, monosaccharide, fructose' molecules that can pass through the lining of the mouth and stomach and small intestines providing fuel directly to cells INSTANTLY by being readily absorbed into the blood stream as soon as one starts chewing and instantly used as fuel without any breakdown needed and WITHOUT any insulin carrier needed, and thus these fruit molecules are TOTALLY DIFFERENT from the 'bad, complex, disaccharide/polysaccharide glucose' molecules which must be broken down and which need insulin carrier units."


Kham wrote:Monosaccharides are the most fundamental units of all sugars and cannot be further hydrolyzed or broken down into simpler compounds. Fructose is a monosaccharides which is found in fruits can pass through the lining of the mouth and stomach, as well as small intestines, just as it is and provides fuel directly to cells.

All other sugars, disaccharides and polysaccharides, must be broken down first, meaning they must go through the digestive process and converted into monosaccharides before cells can absorb them for fuel and so must undergo the digestive process. Disaccharides and polysaccharides ... needs a carrier unit, insulin, to transport them into the cell but fruit sugars or fructose needs nothing.

Modern biology would agree with the above paragraph so it is not in dispute.

The fact that fruit sugars don’t need to be broken down, don’t need a carrier unit and can be readily absorbed into the blood stream as soon as one starts chewing is significant. This means when fruit is eaten the body does not have to spend valuable resources on the complicated digestive process and can instead work on repairing and regenerating the body.

Modern medicine does a real good job of ignoring how easily absorbable are fruit sugars

Image


patrix wrote:Fructose is worse than glucose in the respect that it’s harder for the body to metabolize. That doesn’t mean you cannot eat a little fruit (at least if you're not a diabteic or insulin resistant), but it sure isn’t something that’s better than ordinary sugar.


So currently some of us are still disagreeing about whether fruit is good, or bad.

Kham (and others) have been convinced that FRUIT DOESN'T REQUIRE any breakdown process, and FRUIT DOESN'T REQUIRE any insulin carrier unit, and thus FRUIT IS BETTER than all other sugars.

Patrik (and others) have been convinced that FRUIT REQUIRES a metabolization process, FRUIT REQUIRES an insulin carrier unit, and thus FRUIT IS WORSE than all other sugars.

Now can we all please kindly give both of these posters the benefit of the doubt, that both are sharing the highest truth they have learned about fruit, that neither are shills trying to fool us about fruit, and that both are simply sharing what they feel are facts, facts which they have been convinced of by people whom they trust.

The problem is, unless each of us individually tests our own blood to see if fruit causes insulin spikes or not, we really are simply trusting various "experts" we have fallen in love with through thousands of hours of reading their "expert" facts.

We agree with point A, B, C, and hundreds of other points, which our favorite "expert" has written, in their books/blogs and spoken in their videos, so when our favorite "expert" whom we have come to trust (trust, meaning, stop critically demanding proof of each point) then adds point D we take point D as gospel (since the "expert" seemed to be right about point A, B, C, etc) and thus suddenly we take point D as gospel and start thinking that anyone who disagrees with point D is either a shill or an idiot.

But have we personally tested point D? No, it's all a trust game. And this is the mistake that ALL of us (me included of course) are doing. We are not arguing with each other based on first-hand self-checked PROOF, we are merely arguing with each other like this, "My favorite expert has convinced me that fruit is good!" "My favorite expert has convinced me that fruit is bad!" The real truth is we DON'T KNOW whether fruit is good or bad, we simply are all regurgitating our favorite "expert's" claims.

And this is not just about fruit, not just about nutrition, we make this mistake (of not testing things ourselves) about almost EVERYTHING we argue about on the internet. "Check this expert's link." "No check this opposing expert's link." "Your expert is a shill or an idiot." "No your expert is a shill or an idiot." And even the most honest wonderful expert might be accidentally including a wrong point in their advice. And even the shills will pump out a bunch of perfectly true points to gain our trust and then add in a few purposefully wrong points.

So, I guess we can't agree all agree fruit being healthy or not, because none of us has the ability (or the time/money/energy/will) to test for ourselves. So I guess fruit remains un-agreed upon by the good folks here, such as Patrik & Kham. But can we all agree that whether we eat zero fruit, or a little fruit, or a lot of fruit, no matter what: we all need more FAT (whether from fruit like avocados and olives, or from animals, take your choice) yes?

I really did try to produce a nice debate-ending peacemaking, "You're all correct!" summary. Can we agree on these points?

Observer wrote:As a lifelong vegetarian, grossed out by even 1 drop of meat/chicken/fish/flesh/fat/blood/bones/etc,
I want to help readers see there is NO need to restart the old "animal eating vs. plant eating" debate,
because there are vegetarian fat sources & vegan fat sources we simply need to begin having more of.

Meat-Eaters & Vegetarians, we ALL were fooled by the "wheat is healthy" "low fat is healthy" psy-ops.
C'mon folks, we were fooled by the wheat/starch/low-fat disease-engineers, don't get mad at Patrik.
Thank you Patrik, for altruistically spending so much time and energy helping us realize: we NEED fat.

So meat eaters, simply increase "high-fat: meat" RATIO, go for it y'all, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegetarians, let's simply increase "high-fat: dairy & eggs & plant" RATIO, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegans, simply increase "high-fat: plant" RATIO (olives/coconuts/avocados) while reducing carbs=glucose.

...

Again, vegans simply need more olives/coconuts/avocados/hemp-seeds/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And vegetarians simply need more of the above plus cream/butter/eggs/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And meat-eaters simply need more of the above plus more high-fat-meat, yay, and less carbs=glucose.

And ALL of us, whether plant-specializing or meat-specializing, need to decrease fire and increase RAW.

And in addition to the above advice (which I think we can all agree makes sense) here is an extra bonus:

Cannabis when RAW is non-psychoactive, meaning it doesn't get you high at all, yet creates health.
Heated Cannabis creates health & gets you high, but RAW Cannabis creates health without highness.
What this means is: your parents and grandparents can drink 10 grams daily without any highness. (!)
So, if you need quick health for survival, try cancer-curing-cannabis, high-style or sober-style, either way. :)
(See "The Power of Raw Cannabis" video)

C'mon everybody, we ALL need to improve our health, so we can happily meet up at Simon's for a party!
When we get away from the rude keyboard and begin shaking hands and checking heart vibes in real life,
I think we will realize on a very visceral gut-reaction level that almost all us humans are real good family.
Imagine us partying at Simon's house once a year (or twice a year) laughing together at our online debates.
When fellow humans sit together IRL, the actual heart vibe can be physically felt, then: friendship begins. :wub:
Let's remember that having fun with people in real life, playing together & laughing, are essential for health! :)
Last edited by Observer on Sat Oct 13, 2018 2:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby sharpstuff on Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:37 am

Oh, dear, I shall be banned...

I was reading the thread regarding having a section on nutrition and I must say, pretty horrified, since I knew that it would result in a load of 'diet' stuff.

My apologies for not quoting the member who said the same thing in different words.

Now we get 'Observer' giving over his/her interpretations of ill-health and the drivel that ensues with all the fairy-tales of so-called 'science' regarding what Nature does or does not supply. In a word it is pathetic.

Whatever Nature is, or how we perceive it (masculine or feminine) it is from that that we are produced (or come about). Nature is not self-destructive, only the creature known as 'Man'. There are no 'germs' or 'viruses' (or indeed 'aliens' from outer-space).

'Bacteria' are non-existent until required by a self-healing body (if it is allowed to). 'Good' or 'bad' exist only in the minds of the ignorati.

Nature is a continuum within what we call the 'universe'. It must be a dynamic continuum, which I do not believe that we are able to fathom, merely explore ideas. There is not, in my view at least, any way we can explain it to fruition, any more than we can explain the actvities of leaves on a tree or the dear creatures \I call my 'feline' companions.

It is said that 'You are what you eat'. This may be fine in itself but we have to remember that we live in a conducive atmosphere (or did) for our lives and not all 'eats' are available, assimilateable and so forth..

All this tripe about 'carbohydrates' 'calories' (units of measurement) and other invented chemicals (including the theory (!) ) of atoms and molecules belongs in the fantasy and pockets of those promoting it for their own ends, not ours. Whilst sometimes useful for alchemical reasons, these theories (except as we may want them) are not actual products of Nature, only the transformation of one thing into something else.

A lable (noun) doth not maketh Man or anything else. A noun does not describe, it only attributes a lable for convenience.

Unless it is compromised by intervention, Nature gives us everything that are our needs, if we accept them and learn how to apply them. Nature also requires SUNLIGHT to activate our injestion of substances (whatever they may be called).

The creature we call 'Man' has had a long time to find out what is or is not conducive to our 'health' and survival as individuals.

We cannot single out any particular substance(s) for our health. Our health is detemnined to the extent to which we allow others to determine it.

It should be obvious that given the differences in our geographical locations (whatever they may be) that some things are 'good' for us and some things are 'not good' for us. This is the process of learning. To tell others is a question of a learning process for them. To tell others that such-and-such is good for them may well be their downfall.

One might even consider a thread on the fakery of food...

My apologies if I have misrepresented anyone.

As always in good faith,
Sharpstuff

[Admin Note by SCS: Dear Sharpstuff, I took the liberty of cleaning up a number of typos for the benefit of our readers. I hope that’s okay with you. :) ]
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby patrix on Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:28 pm

Again to claim fructose is harmless and even preferable to glucose is a complete and utter fallacy. Even the sugar companies know they wouldn't get away with such a lie in their bought research so they instead claim fructose is not worse than sucrose (sugar) which is a little more true since they are equally bad. And poison is always a matter of dosage. Watch the video I linked to and educate yourself.

Try to engage your minds and logic here. I know you can since you have figured out 9/11 and the Space Hoax for example.

In the early 20th century obesity and western diseases were practically unheard of. Go back and look at some old photos. Now I think we can agree the situation is different. So what happened? Genes? Moral degradation? We move too little and eat too much? Do any of the official explanations really make sense, or could there be malicious intent hidden here? You know, like some orchestrating 9/11 for their own benefit with no consideration of the consequences? And if so, this area would have its propaganda and disinformation. Just like 9/11 and NASA. Judy Woods, Flat Earth.

Now back to the enigma of the explosion of disease. What could have caused this? Genes? Environment?
Looking at the environment, food is of course a big factor and a lot has changed since the beginning of the century.
We now consume less fat and vegetable fats instead of animal fats. We also consume much higher amounts of sugar and grains packed together with processed vegetable fats and sugar and all kinds of chemicals.

But if you go "healthy" and think that the way to do that is to avoid fats and meat and go for natural healthy vegetables and fruits, you are still going towards accelerated ageing and most likely disease. Why? Because natural fat is the most important nutrient and the safest source of energy. Carbohydrates and especially sugar/fructose are problematic in high amounts. The body can handle some, but no too much. And if you use that as your main source of energy together with processed vegetable oils instead of animal fats, you are in a very bad situation.

I have older relatives around me that have become sick because they thought they were doing something healthy, i.e. consuming less fat and eating lots of healthy grains, vegetables and fruit. What typically happens then is that since the body lacks enough fat, things will break. The hips and back are one example since those two areas are high maintenance. And what does the health care system do? Offer invasive and mutilating back and prosthesis suregery that will worsen the situation even more after a couple of years. Or heart medications that chemically disturbs the bodys natural healing processes. And it’s the icing on the cake, since we now have more health problems, and we will pay even more attention to not eating fat and choose healthy grains and fruits. That’s the very thing that got us sick in the first place.

I'm not saying this to pick a fight and offend, but because I care. But what you get here is hostility, awkwardness and ridicule. And I have provided sources for my claims, and there is a growing awareness of this now fortunately.

And I also get angry because I think we have a responsibility to investigate things and have backing for the advice we dish out. Especially health advice. But I don't see much of that. Everyone is an expert here and just knows what’s right from watching their favorite guru on youtube.

Edit:
>and FRUIT DOESN'T REQUIRE any insulin carrier unit
Bloody hell. Where does this crap come from!?
That's a truth with a nasty lacing. No, since fructose needs to be processed the same way as alcohol, and too much fructose will also lead to exactly the same disease caused by alcohol - fatty liver disease. Watch that video.
Last edited by patrix on Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Observer on Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:51 pm

Patrik, leaving aside for a moment Kham's/Agraposo's/HonestlyNow's/(&my) "fruits are healthy" theory,
can you nicely confirm you agree with my quote below which nicely summarizes the "FAT vital" theory?
I'm reminding everyone: we can all agree HIGH FAT FRUITS like olives and avocados are healthy, right?

Observer wrote:Meat-Eaters & Vegetarians, we ALL were fooled by the "wheat is healthy" "low fat is healthy" psy-ops.
C'mon folks, we were fooled by the wheat/starch/low-fat disease-engineers, don't get mad at Patrik.
Thank you Patrik, for altruistically spending so much time and energy helping us realize: we NEED fat.

So meat eaters, simply increase "high-fat: meat" RATIO, go for it y'all, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegetarians, let's simply increase "high-fat: dairy & eggs & plant" RATIO, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegans, simply increase "high-fat: plant" RATIO (olives/coconuts/avocados) while reducing carbs=glucose.

...

Again, vegans simply need more olives/coconuts/avocados/hemp-seeds/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And vegetarians simply need more of the above plus cream/butter/eggs/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And meat-eaters simply need more of the above plus more high-fat-meat, yay, and less carbs=glucose.

And ALL of us, whether plant-specializing or meat-specializing, need to decrease fire and increase RAW.


And we all can agree with Agraposo's "judicious controlled fasting" & FBenario's "simply limit quantity", right? :)
Last edited by Observer on Sat Oct 13, 2018 2:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby patrix on Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:59 pm

Observer » October 12th, 2018, 3:51 pm wrote:Patrik, leaving aside for a moment Kham's/Agraposo's/HonestlyNow's/(&my) "fruits are healthy" theory,
can you nicely confirm you agree with my quote below which nicely summarizes the "FAT vital" theory?
I'm reminding everyone: we can all agree HIGH FAT FRUITS like olives and avocados are healthy, right?

Observer wrote:Meat-Eaters & Vegetarians, we ALL were fooled by the "wheat is healthy" "low fat is healthy" psy-ops.
C'mon folks, we were fooled by the wheat/starch/low-fat disease-engineers, don't get mad at Patrik.
Thank you Patrik, for altruistically spending so much time and energy helping us realize: we NEED fat.

So meat eaters, simply increase "high-fat: meat" intake, go for it y'all, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegetarians, let's simply increase "high-fat: dairy & eggs & plant" intake, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegans, simply increase "high-fat: plant" intake (olives/coconuts/avocados) while reducing carbs=glucose.

...

Again, vegans simply need more olives/coconuts/avocados/hemp-seeds/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And vegetarians simply need more of the above plus cream/butter/eggs/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And meat-eaters simply need more of the above plus more high-fat-meat, yay, and less carbs=glucose.

And ALL of us, whether plant-specializing or meat-specializing, need to decrease fire and increase RAW.


And we all can agree with Agraposo's "judicious controlled fasting" & FBenario's "simply limit quantity", right? :)


That's a pretty good summary. To much lean muscle meat (protein) is not good, and that's what many meat eaters eat to avoid the "dangerous" saturated fat.
But I think we all need some animal protein and fat, but that could be for example eggs and butter/ghee and not meat.
I see no reason to not have animal fat in the diet and I'm unsure if the healthier vegetable fats you mention is adequate.

Yes, fasting is great.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Observer on Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:26 pm

patrix wrote:I think we all need some animal protein and fat, but that could be for example eggs and butter/ghee and not meat.

Good, so for all us vegetarians (like me) who realistically are NEVER going to start eating animals,
we should increase our RATIO of high-fat foods like eggs/butter/cream/etc. We can agree there. :)


patrix wrote:I see no reason to not have animal fat in the diet and I'm unsure if the healthier vegetable fats you mention is adequate.

Meanwhile, for all vegans who realistically are NEVER going to start eating animals or eggs or dairy,
they should increase their RATIO of high-fat foods like olives/avocados/hemp-seeds/etc. We agree. :)


patrix wrote:Yes, fasting is great.

Good, we agree here too. :)


Observer wrote:Cannabis when RAW is non-psychoactive, meaning it doesn't get you high at all, yet creates health.
Heated Cannabis creates health & gets you high, but RAW Cannabis creates health without highness.
What this means is: your parents and grandparents can drink 10 grams daily without any highness. (!)
So, if you need quick health for survival, try cancer-curing-cannabis, high-style or sober-style, either way. :)
(See "The Power of Raw Cannabis" video)

Probably we all can agree on the above paragraph as well. :)


Observer wrote:C'mon everybody, we ALL need to improve our health, so we can happily meet up at Simon's for a party!
When we get away from the rude keyboard and begin shaking hands and checking heart vibes in real life,
I think we will realize on a very visceral gut-reaction level that almost all us humans are real good family.
Imagine us partying at Simon's house once a year (or twice a year) laughing together at our online debates.
When fellow humans sit together IRL, the actual heart vibe can be physically felt, then: friendship begins. :wub:
Let's remember that having fun with people in real life, playing together & laughing, are essential for health! :)

And probably we all can agree on the above paragraph as well. :)


So, in the end, as long as we stay away from the question of whether Fruitarians are healthy or not,
my peaceful summary can (with the unfortunate exception of the thread starter) be agreed on by all:

Observer wrote:Meat-Eaters & Vegetarians, we ALL were fooled by the "wheat is healthy" "low fat is healthy" psy-ops.
C'mon folks, we were fooled by the wheat/starch/low-fat disease-engineers, don't get mad at Patrik.
Thank you Patrik, for altruistically spending so much time and energy helping us realize: we NEED fat.

So meat eaters, simply increase "high-fat: meat" RATIO, go for it y'all, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegetarians, let's simply increase "high-fat: dairy & eggs & plant" RATIO, while reducing carbs=glucose.
Vegans, simply increase "high-fat: plant" RATIO (olives/coconuts/avocados) while reducing carbs=glucose.

...

Again, vegans simply need more olives/coconuts/avocados/hemp-seeds/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And vegetarians simply need more of the above plus cream/butter/eggs/etc, and less carbs=glucose.
And meat-eaters simply need more of the above plus more high-fat-meat, yay, and less carbs=glucose.

And ALL of us, whether plant-specializing or meat-specializing, need to decrease fire and increase RAW.

And we all can agree with Agraposo's "judicious controlled fasting" & FBenario's "simply limit quantity". :)

And in addition to the above advice (which I think we can all agree makes sense) here is an extra bonus:

Cannabis when RAW is non-psychoactive, meaning it doesn't get you high at all, yet creates health.
Heated Cannabis creates health & gets you high, but RAW Cannabis creates health without highness.
What this means is: your parents and grandparents can drink 10 grams daily without any highness. (!)
So, if you need quick health for survival, try cancer-curing-cannabis, high-style or sober-style, either way. :)
(See "The Power of Raw Cannabis" video)

C'mon everybody, we ALL need to improve our health, so we can happily meet up at Simon's for a party!
When we get away from the rude keyboard and begin shaking hands and checking heart vibes in real life,
I think we will realize on a very visceral gut-reaction level that almost all us humans are real good family.
Imagine us partying at Simon's house once a year (or twice a year) laughing together at our online debates.
When fellow humans sit together IRL, the actual heart vibe can be physically felt, then: friendship begins. :wub:
Let's remember that having fun with people in real life, playing together & laughing, are essential for health! :)


Image
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby patrix on Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:05 pm

The Fungi-Cancer Hypothesis

Many writers write at interesting locations to engage. So how about at 10000 meters doing 900 km/h? But I guess trans-tlantic flights aren't that exotic anymore.

Simon Shack, in my view the most accomplished researcher/dicsoverer in modern times, have shown us that it is important to ask big questions. 9/11 and other terror events could not have happened the way media claims. It's physically impossible for rockets to create propulsion in space. And the Copernican model is in fact, as Simon has lately demonstrated, impossible.

So we need to be open minded, but not so open minded that our brain falls out. I don't know about the fuel capacity of this plane, but I hope it's enough to bring me cross. I don't know if the flight attendants are of the opposite sex from what they appear to have, and I don't see why I should care either. From my window I can see the horizon but no curvature, as some conspiracy theorists like to point out that you should/shouldn't see from a plane. I would say a couple of degrees in a long stretch isn't noticable without some kind of reference. A settled question here I know, but if you haven't been able to conceptualize that the Earth cannot be of any other shape than spherical, then you should stop reading this and study the subject of disinformation a bit further. You see, if we're busy looking down the wrong rabbit holes, then we are more likely to overlook the ones that matter.

A little something about my background that's relevant. I've always liked to figure things out. And I've actually sometimes had bad conscience for thinking too much. I have no formal medical training except some in the army. We have drafting where I live. I come from a family of doctors and I've sat out a few discussions on medicine at the side of my parents although I didn't understand much since I wasn't interested in medicine until much later in life. Now I'm making a living as an IT professional, which suits me since you're mostly done when you've figured things out. My interest in medicine started about 10 years ago when I understood that some theories dissmissed by experts and media could be right. That sparked my interest and I have since learned many things and also talked to friends and family with formal medical training about it.

One thing that's important to know is that in many countries you will lose your license and thus ability to make a living as a doctor if you go against common medicine and treat your patients in alternative ways. So the possibility for doctors to add to the body of knowledge of medicine or turn it over completely is limited. The justification for this is that medicine is a serious matter and we can't have quack doctors running around treating people as they see fit. And we see stories in the media about gross malpractice so that we shall understand this must be. Some may of course be true but I find it illogical and simply bad business to for example acquire the skills and equipment to do plastic surgery and then skimp on the implants you use. I've now understood thanks to Simon and CF that we indeed have a big conspiracy upon us that probably have worked against us for generations,, and this gives a different perspective.

Medicine and nutrition is a powerful tool, arguably the most powerful tool for mass control. By influencing what people eat and what medicine they use, health status, life expectancy and reproduction can be controlled. And if people are malnourished and sick they are in survival mode having no time or capacity to ponder the state of world affairs. So I find it logical that medicine is controlled by the Nutwork.

Onto the subject matter - The Fungi-Cancer hypothesis

Fungi is according to what I've read the oldest life form on this planet. They supposedly were the first to colonize land from the sea millions of years ago and cellular life are apparently in symbiosis with fungi. Without the help of microfungi plants, animals and man would not be able to metabolize nutrients, carbon dioxide or oxygen.

Fungi are all around and ever present. And if the homestasis in cellular life is disturbed, they immediately begin feasting. Perhaps that's why they stay around and help us with our metabolism? They are waiting for that banquet they get when we die. :) To live as cellular life could actually be defined as maintaining the ability to not be decomposed by fungi. Minutes after we die, we start to rot or in other words eaten by fungi. Leave an apple on the bench and after a few days and the same thing happens.

So if this is the case, could it be that also when we are alive that fungi could get the upper hand so to speak in a way that would be harmful to us? I think so and I will now hypothesize that this state is what we generally call illness.

If our immune system becomes weakened or overloaded, the fungi in our organism will strengthen, and if this goes too far, it may start consuming our cells even though we still are alive. It can be hypothesized that the very purpose of our immune system is to keep this event at bay, and that inflammation and eventually disease is a sign of failure that requires the body to bring in a second line of defense by making us ill and raising our body temperature. It so happens that the most common microfungi that we have in us - Aspergellus and Candida, are very sensitive to temperature.

But if this also fails, then the next lines of defense must be brought in and I hypothesize that one of these defenses is what we call cancer. Cancer are cells that are said to grow uncontrollably, but this doesn't seem to be the case. They typically grow in a confined area called a tumor. And the body seems to take great effort in supplying the cancerous cells in this tumor with nutrients by growing extra blood vessels, and the immune cells leave them alone. The body seems to care for it's cancer. Why?

What if the purpose of a tumor is to seal off and suffocate invasive fungi growth? Mycotoxins is toxins that fungi secrets in order to break down cells so they can feast on them. It also happens to be the most cancerous substance we know of. So could this be a signal to cells that we have a ongoing fungi invasion and that they therefore need to become cancerous to stop the infection?

An analogy could be made against plants/trees. Many trees have lumps or knots. Could these be the same type of defense as cancer? Fungi is invading causing the tree to rot, and it defends itself by sealing off and suffocating the fungi by creating a knot.

Fungi favorite food is sugar and when cells become cancerous they switch to fermentation-only mode. This means that they only use sugar for fuel as opposed to normal cells that use respiraton (fat and oxygen fueled) and switch to fermentation only when needed. Fungi needs sugar, so with sugar consuming cells around them it can be assumed they become weaker.

Causes
I have now speculated on what cancer could be, but an interesting subject if this has any substance, is of course what causes cancer or more specifically fungi overgrowth.

Carbohydrates
IWe have a glucose metabolism, and we also have the capability to convert fructose into fat. This is very beneficial if our other energy source - fat, is scarce. And we seem to get our appetite up-regulated when we are subjected to carbs especially fructose, meaning we love sweets and can easily eat more than we need and convert the surplus to fat. This can be speculated is a mechanism for survival. In prehistoric times it would be beneficial to gorge on fruits the short period they were available and store the extra energy as body fat for later usage.

But this appetite for carbs could cause problems if we are subjected to them all the time. All carbs convert to sugar in our body and our cells can metabolize that but so can the fungus. It's observed that when a person only eats fat, the blood glucose levels becomes lower. It will never become dangerously low because our liver will create glucose when needed out of fat in a process called glycogenesis.

But in a constant mode of "carb burning" as opposed to "fat burning" which was probably the more common state in prehistory since carbs wasn't as readily available as now, it can be theorized that this will give our symbiotic fungi a bit to much food that makes it grow and become a problem.

Processed vegetable oils and other "modern foods"
We are eating very different compared to our past and in the last decades, new types of foods and ingredients that we never have subjected to before have been introduced into our diet. One of those is processed or hydrogenated vegetable oil. The point of this is that it makes a vegetable oil solid so it can be used as spread for example. A problem however is that they are suspected to be unhealthy. If we consume large amounts, they will be used for cell repair, but because they are not as stable as natural fats, the cell membranes become weaker which increases the risk of the cell being damaged. And there are several other new products that appear problematic, unfermented soy for example, but since unbiased studies are not carried out it's difficult to know

Frequent meals
Eating is stressful for the body and we should limit intake to three times per day or less.

Stress, lack of sleep and an overactive lifestyle
Our immune system needs rest, but today's life style is very hectic and demanding which contribute to increased risk of illness and disease including cancer.

High energy radiation and other environmental factors
I do think ionizing radiation can cause cancer, but I believe the explanation model is wrong. If you stand in a microwave you will get burned from the inside out causing internal cell death and food for the fungi, leading to cancer. The bone marrow will also be damaged which impairs the immune system. I don't believe in long lasting effects and cancer risk from low radiation sources.

In fact any poison or environmental stress factor shows a connection to cancer, arguably in this hypothesis because that creates cell death an impaired immune system and thus increased risk of fungal overgrowth.

Summary
The Fungi-Cancer connection has been around for a long time and two doctors I know of - Eric Enby and Tullio Simoncini, have lost their license and been smeared for promoting it and treating patients with fungicides. I have not however seen any hypothesis on this connection and this is my attempt at doing that.

I would appreciate relevant criticism. Any hypothesis needs that. If you know of observations that disprove this, please speak up. But please refrain from nosensuals.

Approaching destination so I'm going to end for now, but since medicine and nutrition seems to be such an inflammatory subject here I just want to make clear that this is speculation and it's fine if you believe other things.

Apologies on the formatting. It's hard to do from a tablet.
Last edited by patrix on Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:13 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Observer on Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:04 am

patrix wrote:The Fungi-Cancer Hypothesis


...

The Fungi-Cancer hypothesis

Fungi is according to what I've read the oldest life form on this planet. They supposedly were the first to colonize land from the sea millions of years ago and cellular life are apparently in symbiosis with fungi. Without the help of microfungi plants, animals and man would not be able to metabolize nutrients, carbon dioxide or oxygen.

Fungi are all around and ever present. And if the homestasis in cellular life is disturbed, they immediately begin feasting. Perhaps that's why they stay around and help us with our metabolism? They are waiting for that banquet they get when we die. :) To live as cellular life could actually be defined as maintaining the ability to not be decomposed by fungi. Minutes after we die, we start to rot or in other words eaten by fungi. Leave an apple on the bench and after a few days and the same thing happens.

So if this is the case, could it be that also when we are alive that fungi could get the upper hand so to speak in a way that would be harmful to us? I think so and I will now hypothesize that this state is what we generally call illness.

If our immune system becomes weakened or overloaded, the fungi in our organism will strengthen, and if this goes too far, it may start consuming our cells even though we still are alive. It can be hypothized that the very purpose of our immune system is to keep this event at bay, and that inflammation and eventually disease is a sign of failure that requires the body to bring in a second line of defense by making us ill and raising our body temperature. It so happens that the most common microfungi that we have in us - Aspergellus and Candida, are very sensitive to temperature.

But if this also fails, then the next lines of defense must be brought in and I hypothesize that one of these defenses is what we call cancer. Cancer are cells that are said to grow uncontrollably, but this doesn't seem to be the case. They typically grow in a confined area called a tumour. And the body seems to take great effort in supplying the cancerous cells in this tumour with nutrients by growing extra blood vessels, and the immune cells leave them alone. The body seems to care for it's cancer. Why?

What if the purpose of a tumor is to seal off and suffocate invasive fungi growth? Mycotoxins is toxins that fungi secrets in order to break down cells so they can feast on them. It also happens to be the most cancerous substance we know of. So could this be a signal to cells that we have a ongoing fungi invasion and that they therefore need to become cancerous to stop the infection?

An analogy could be made against plants/trees. Many trees have lumps or knots. Could these be the same type of defense as cancer? Fungi is invading causing the tree to rot, and it defends itself by sealing off and suffocating the fungi by creating a knot.

Fungi favorite food is sugar and when cells become cancerous they switch to fermentation only mode. This means that they only use sugar for fuel as opposed to normal cells that use respiraton (fat and oxygen fueled) and switch to fermentation only when needed. Fungi needs sugar, so with sugar consuming cells around them it can be assumed they become weaker.

Causes
I have now speculated on what cancer could be, but an interesting subject if this has any substance, is of course what causes cancer or more specifically fungi overgrowth.

Carbohydrates
IWe have a glucose metabolism, and we also have the capability to convert fructose into fat. This is very beneficial if our other energy source - fat, is scarce. And we seem to get our apatite up-regulated when we are subjected to carbs especially fructose, meaning we love sweets and can easily eat more than we need and convert the surplus to fat. This can be speculated is a mechanism for survival. In prehistoric times it would be beneficial to gorge on fruits the short period they were available and store the extra energy as body fat for later usage.

But this appetite for carbs could cause problems if we are subjected to them all the time. All carbs convert to sugar in our body and our cells can metabolize that but so can the fungus. It's observed that when a person only eats fat, the blood glucose levels becomes lower. It will never become dangerously low because our liver will create glucose when needed out of fat in a process called glycogenesis.

But in a constant mode of "carb burning" as opposed to "fat burning" which was probably the more common state in prehistory since carbs wasn't as readily available as now, it can be theorized that this will give our symbiotic fungi a bit to much food that makes it grow and become a problem.

Processed vegetable oils and other "modern foods"
We are eating very different as of past and especially in the last decade new types of foods and ingredients we never have subjected to before have been introduced into our diet. One of those is processed or hydrogenated vegetable oil. The point of this is that an oil becomes solid and can thus be used as spread for example. A problem however is that they are suspected to be unhealthy. If we consume large amounts, they will be used for cell repair, but since they are not as stable as natural fats the cell membranes become weaker. And there are several other new products that appear problematic, unfermented soy for example, but since undbiased studies are not carried out it's difficult to know

Frequent meals
Eating is stressful for the body and we should limit intake to three times per day or less.

Stress, lack of sleep and an overactive lifestyle
Our immune system needs rest, but todays life style is very hectic and demanding which contribute to incerased risk of illness and disease including cancer.

High energy radiation and other environmental factors
I do think ionizing radiation can cause cancer, but I believe the explanation model is wrong. If you stand in a microwave you will get burned from the inside out causing internal cell death and food for the fungi, leading to cancer. The bone marrow will also be damaged which impairs the immune system. I don't believe in long lasting effects and cancer risk from low radiation sources.

In fact any "poison" or environmental stress factor shows a connection to cancer, arguably in this hypothesis because that creates cell death an impared immune system and thus increased risk of fungal overgrowth.

Summary
The Fungi-Cancer connection has been around for a long time and two doctors I know of - Eric Enby and Tullio Simoncini, have lost their license and been smeared for promoting it and treating patients with fungicides.
I have not however seen any hypothesis on this connection and this is my attempt on doing that.

I would appreciate relevant criticism. Any hypothesis needs that. If you know of observations that disprove this, please speak up.

...


All makes sense Patrik. :)

Hmmm, I have to admit:

* It does seem sweet things (ALL sweet things, OK perhaps even fruit) do help bacteria/fungi grow.
* And yes, then, the body wisely tries to kill the bacteria/fungi overgrowth by turning up the heat.
* And yes, then, the body wisely tries to kill the bacteria/fungi overgrowth by sealing off the area.
* And thus, let fevers do their good work, and let seal-off-areas (called tumors) do their good work.
* And thus, prevent bacteria/fungi overgrowth in the first place by not giving them what they want.
* And what bacteria/fungi want is sweet stuff, whether we call it sucrose or glucose or fructose, OK.

Thus, as you've been saying Patrik, "increase fat ratio & decrease carbs, thus decrease ALL sweet stuff."

And perhaps we should add, "increase natural fungicides ratio, to prevent bacteria/fungi overgrowth." (?)
Perhaps this might be a case of a few plant oils (Tea-Tree/Jojoba/Oregano/etc) being very beneficial. (?)

Until now I had been labeling the enemy "bacteria", but it seems the correct term is "fungi-overgrowth."
Perhaps even SharpStuff can admit: "fungi-overgrowth" is an actual real BAD thing we want to PREVENT.

Perhaps we really are getting closer to agreement in this thread, identifying the real problem & solution:
They encouraged us to eat fungi-overgrowth-causing stuff like wheat/pasta/bread, and yes OK even fruit.
So this problem's real solution for health, to cure & prevent disease, is simply: Prevent Fungi-Overgrowth.

FBenario said, "Eat just a little each day" and Patrik adds, "Choose foods which Prevent Fungi-Overgrowth.
Yes, eat just a few ounces/kilograms a day, and make the ratio: high-fat, low-carbs thus low-sweet-stuff.

Vegetarians/Vegans were justly fighting the inferred stance of: "to get essential fat, one must eat animals."
Now it's clearer: "to get essential fat one can eat animals, or eggs, or dairy, or high-fat seeds/nuts/plants."

So, for ALL humans: eat just a little food, make it high-fat, low-carbs thus low-sweet-stuff, raw if possible.

I know SharpStuff, you didn't intend any "diet" conclusion, but this conclusion seems like a practical solution.
We want to increase health. Even one "beyond the ignorati duality of good & bad" can agree: Health is Good.
The parasites who profit from us having dis-ease: engineered fake diseases and pushed dis-ease causing food.


Health Solution Habit: eat just a little food, make it high-fat, low-carbs thus low-sweet-stuff, raw if possible. :)
Last edited by Observer on Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby aa5 on Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:23 am

I agree with your linking cancer to fungus. What if the cancer is a hybrid human cell/fungus. Where the fungus has reproduced/replicated with one of our cells.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Kham on Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:16 am

What About Cancer

The lymph system is the sewer system for cell waste, damaged cells and residual acids from foods that flow in through one way valves into the lymph veins. All cells are surrounded by clear lymph fluid. Pop a pimple and besides puss and blood, that clear fluid that comes out is lymph fluid. Throughout the lymph system there are lymph nodes which contain macrophages which break down damaged and replaced cells and acids. After that garbage is safely broken down it is once again sent along the lymph veins which eventually all empty into the kidneys. The kidneys filter the lymph fluid to kept it free flowing and this waste is then sent along to the bladder which then gets urinated out of the body.

The blood veins are the kitchen of the body feeding our cells and the lymph system is the sewer system removing the waste as each cell is not clean burning and like everything that eats, cells also produce waste.

The error in modern medicine is its failure to address the waste system of the human body which is the lymph system.

What about cancer? Cancer is simply an overstuffed and overtaxed lymph node which naturally contain damaged cells as this is it job, to break down damaged and replaced cells.

Cancer = lymphedema

Lymphedema happens when kidney filtration is impaired causing acids to back up and stagnate which then burdens the lymph nodes. When surgeons remove ‘cancer’ they are actually removing lymph nodes packed full of debris. When lymph nodes are removed so is the bodies natural system to cleanse and heal itself.

A stagnated lymph system attracts all sorts of parasites and fungi who feed on these backed up toxins and acids, much like rats and cockroaches who seem to find and then invade filthy homes. Clean up the home and the vermin leave as their food source is removed.

Clean eating, as in raw, means less cell waste. Less waste means a cleaner more fluid lymph system which assists lymph nodes in doing their job, breaking down toxins and damaged and replaced cells. No more lymph nodes over burdened with debris so no more ‘cancer’.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Observer on Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:30 am

Kham wrote:... residual acids from foods
... acids.
... Lymphedema happens when kidney filtration is impaired causing acids to back up and stagnate
... parasites and fungi who feed on these backed up toxins and acids

Clean eating, as in raw, means less cell waste. Less waste means a cleaner more fluid lymph system which assists lymph nodes in doing their job, breaking down toxins and damaged and replaced cells. No more lymph nodes over burdened with debris so no more ‘cancer’.


Quite right, that's a very good point. which I forgot to add to my summary: the importance of high pH.

Food-grade baking soda can be drunk, to raise the pH from within, or bathed in, for taking in thru skin.

And even without baking soda, just take what you eat and add some veggies: naturally alkaline high pH.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby patrix on Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:17 am

I agree that a working lymphatic system is important and that it's the sewer system of the body, but to say lymphedema is the same as cancer is a stretch. Cancer is a sponge like tissue and different from swollen lymph glands. I'm curious to where this hypothesis comes from and what you think supports it.

The gene theory of cancer should however be as dead and buried as the Copernican model.

This researcher https://youtu.be/VMArOJw2oKo Thomas Seyfried demonstrated this many years ago in a controlled experiment by swapping the cell nucleus (that contains the genetic material) in healthy and cancerous cells. The cancerous cell did not become healthy and vice versa. This has never been challenged. Only met with deafening silence.
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby SacredCowSlayer on Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:38 pm

Temporary Admin Notice and Request by SCS:

Dear CF members, I have begun the slow process of locating previously discussed health and nutrition posts that may be found in otherwise non-germane topics such as the “Chatbox” and the Derailing Room. There are probably still some in the “Einstein and other gods of science” thread.

If our kind and hardworking members see fit to point some of these out to me (in the interest of getting them all in the same place), please let me know in the “Administrator Request” thread.

Thank you for any assistance, as I consider this topic important, and I also wish to keep the forum as orderly as possible.

I also want to express my sincere gratitude for the much improved health and tone of the exchanges that have transpired since this topic has been reopened.

I’m comfortable speaking for both myself and Simon on that particular point.

Sincerely,

SCS :)

scs

scs@cluesforum.info
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Re: Engineering disease

Postby Kham on Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:04 pm

How Can An Overstuffed and Hard Lymph Node Be Called Cancer?

Our bodies are continually replacing cells. Where do they go? Dead and damaged cells flow into the lymph vessels, not blood vessels, which then go through a series of lymph nodes which break down dead cells into safe particles. Modern medicine calls these no longer useful cells cancer cells and and the lymph nodes that house them the cancer.

Also, modern medicine calls the lymph system that connects the lymph nodes such things as cytoskeletal filaments including microtubules and microfilaments which they claim are highly dynamic structures mainly involved in cell movements and proliferation of cancer cells. Cancer cells cannot travel and infect other cells because they are themselves simply the damaged cells whose time has come for replacement which have gathered in lymph nodes, aka septic tanks, for safe disposal.

The lymph vessels and lymph nodes are quite misunderstood by modern medicine. The lymph systems precise mapping has of yet not been done. If one researched it what one will find is that each medical text book has something different to say concerning its extent and actual role. At this point NO ONE has proof of from where cancers emanate, they have theories, at least not until the lymph system gets mapped. Seems like Dr. Morse, though, is as close to the truth as one can get on account of the hundreds of thousands of testimonials of people ‘getting cured’ from cancer by cleaning out and making fluid the lymph system, which allows those hard packed lymph nodes to finally process their loads of damaged cells sending their output down the line as well as getting the kidneys to once again filter at optimum capacity.

The Final Frontier of the human body is the mapping of the lymph system.
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